On global labs, post spec eva removal, damage is still a joke for a class that brings no utility to the fight. Full glass build on 5 debo, nouver build - 349 ap with hdmg doesn't effectively one combo anything while you can die easily in one combo. Serpent takes maybe 20% off of someone's hp bar. Any mix of accuracy accessories doesn't make it better. It's just bad, especially since they felt the need to nerf our damage more when Drak, Ranger, Archer, Woosa, Maegu, and many more were easily outdpsing us without having to rely on cc and air attack mods to get damage out.

Our role is to be an assassin. If you can't kill people quickly on a class that is only built for damage and, and can't effectively cc anything because everything is overprotected, what's the point of the class? Revert the shadow stomp and serpent nerfs, and ACTUALLY BUFF OUR DAMAGE PA! If we're in a tank meta where bruisers and tanks can eat through multiple people beating on them, then you need to create the anti-meta that can kill them to balance it out. Mind you, I don't want to go back to people dying instantly in SA. I want people to die when they're on their back after being cc'd. I want the damage to combo people to death.

I'm tired of years of trade-off changes. I want actual buffs. Not just making a skill slightly faster or adding a new skill chain in exchange for moving a cc off the kit or adding protection for it, but lowering dmg and removing cc. Give me damage to do my job, PA.

And before anybody comments in this thread that Ninja oneshots people with serpent - stop living in 2018. We don't do that anymore, and haven't for a very long time. If you dying instantly to anybody, especially a ninja, you're either undergeared or you're also running a full glass cannon build. Nobody should be dying instantly in this current meta in a 1v1, and you're being disingenuous if you say you are.

Sadly have to agree (imo). What I'd like to add is that ninja is either too squishy or deals too little dmg and that is even with a great AP passive and a stackable melee AP pre buff. The class isn't a reliable damage dealer but also no reliable tank. I can recommend playing a different class for stuff like guild league where gear score matters.

You have plenty of Iframes, so crying that you can die easily on 1 combo seems strange. This is the class. You are suppose to be elusive, and with the right play you are.

Ninjas are hard to catch, and are annoying to play against. The class in my opinion is perfectly fine.
Ninja is quite fine and i'm happy where we at at the moment.

And before start crying, my main is Awa Ninja.

I'm just tired of crybaby that wants buffs or nerfs for absolutely no reason. It's not your job to balance the game.

I'm glad you're content with being useless. That makes one out of many people who quit or continue to drop this class in favor of others.

Meanwhile, highest ranked ninja for aos on your region doesn't want to play the game unless aos is around. Shows how fine and great the class/game is as a whole.

Also main is awk ninja, but your account is marked as warrior main? Ok, bud. Class is definitely perfectly fine when there are millions of other classes who are easier and do more than Ninja. That's why 90% of ninjas you meet in aos are pepegas without hands, who cc themselves on your skills, or are the first ones to die on their teams despite having "plenty of iframes." That's why nw/siege guilds were desperately recruiting for ninjas pre and post nw rework! Let's also ignore the fact that there are classes with more iframes and do our job better.

I love people who fight against their own best interests. Keep up the good fight.

If you think this class is fine in it's current state you are delusional. The class at 850ap is comparable to other classes at 700. It's unplayable in the current NW system because objectives are basically meaningless now and there's no structure anymore, and even on capped your extended combo doesnt kill anything. Siege it's hilariously bad and you can't really even approach a ball fight. You babysit cannons at most and any class can do that. AOS is the only place the class is playable but isnt even close to meta in the only type of combat (small scale) that it's supposed to excel in.

Gleague the class was useless/became a CC bot with full evasion. By the end of it everyone playing the class that was notable pretty much swapped off/ignored the content. Or they played in the low ranks for fun. The value of the class has always been in taking out high value targets quickly and it doesnt function in that role anymore. It hasn't, in truth, for a pretty long time. Even pre DR change the class (awk not succ) did not have the damage to actively use evasion. The only time you'd see an awk ninja even attempt evasion is if they had gear swaps to tailor their build to whoever they are fighting. Spec evasion gutted the class further after the hit changes and the Ninja discord pretty unanimously said reroll or quit. (the pinned guide was a hash video).

Ninja has plenty of iframes but is limited in chaining them and is full of gaps so your argument seems short sighted. Ninja is severely more unprotected than dosa, scholar, sorc, tamer, musa .... and these classes dont have this problem to that extend. Problem is more so ninja doesnt need a full combo to die he usually only needs half a combo but is expected to throw min max combos to get the kill on a BARELY tanky target; super time-inefficient class and you notice such imbalances in group fights even more.

Firstly my main is Ninja. If you want i can screenshot you. I had Succ Warrior, but drop it exactly for Ninja, as i outskilled my Warrior pretty fast, and i wanted something more challenging in terms of skill. Which is the main reason i play Ninja.

Next i don't play NW and cannot said how is the situation there. I mainly play PVE and some AOS and i feel the class is perfectly fine.

It lacks some AOE, and it's not great for some spots, but it should be like this, as the class is great in dense spots.

Who quit the game or class is far from my problems. They can make Ninja do 1 damage, and i will still play it, as i like the class and the joy it brings to me when i play. High APM is like a high dopamine for me. It's also one of the few true skillful classes in the game still.

As far as the overall balance goes, everyone will always cry for something. I always believe players should have zero says in that. They are essentially wasting time and efforts with all that crying. Devs have the actual numbers and can see the bigger picture. The game become a mess, cause the  developer is constantly trying to change stuffs, cause someone decide to cry about X or Y.

Good luck having a balanced game/class/etc that way.

Developer should be the ones doing the balance, not the players, as we are obviously biased.

Well anyone can cherry-pick anything and said my class doesn't have this or that. This to me looks like a skill issue. Learn how to use your kit better. 
To me Ninja class currently is fine. Again i play mainly PVE and AOS, and i comment on this.
Or should only agreeable with OP post be allowed on here?

Every class have + and - , it's should be like that. 
What do you want exactly. To not have a CD on your Iframes, and to be constantly invulnerable? Or 9 out of 10 seconds to be essentially out of the game?

Is it cherry-picking if I answer to your comment? How come you might not be cherry-picking aswell? Either accept it or delete ur comment above.

ANd yeah you dont notice these changes too much in AoS. Try going BA and fight against some people with gear and you might notice something.

What I'd actually want is to have ninja being as tanky as the average class aslong as it does not have severely more dmg than most other classes that simple. A little tweak in base DR or HP. I dont want iframe buffs or anything. I want the class to actually have balanced stats. If it doesnt kill you on certain gear neither should you.

You only do aos? God, no wonder you're oblivious. Of course you don't notice the problem. They just took special eva out of the game after they gave everybody 261 ap bracket for aos. Damage is on crack in aos compared to the rest of the game.