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UTC 15 : 52 Apr 25, 2025
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Succession Sorc - What you COULD have and SHOULD have done.
Mar 18, 2025, 22:24 (UTC)
371 3
Last Edit : Mar 19, 2025, 00:06 (UTC)
# 1

Beyond the PVE damage buffs the current PVP patch is subpar.

Here are just a few small changes all or even just one of them that would have made a nice impact without being OP.

-  TBS have an SA.   Gives us a 2nd protected catch with Eruption remaining as SA.  This is not OP as Succ Sorc does not have a Grab, FG ignoring CC or Block Jump and classes have been buffed to have 100% SA protected rotations.  Succ Sorcs need "options".  It is not OP as often this would happen as a "skilled" manuever where you Stinger -cancel-> TBS behind someone when you see an opening.  You are still at risk from the unprotected Stinger, so not OP.  Note: This was actually in the mondo PVP patch PA placed on GL that was ultimately pulled.  It was s good idea then.  It is a good idea now. 

- Stinger as SA (but not with TBS as SA).  Similar thinking as above but slightly different Pro and Cons.  TBS with SA gives us a stronger but still vulnerable combo against a CC'd opponent in the face of "peeling" where your combo is attempted to be interrupted with a CC.  Stinger with SA give us better catch opportunities and better movement options fighting around the pack.

- Address movement issues by making Rushing a double cast within the cool down.  BUT to not make it OP only the FIRST cast is an SA.   The second cast within the cool down is unprotected.

- Simply increased the Range on Eruption which is very small for a Mid-Range class and is our core CC catch option.  This change was acutually posted on GL a few patches ago but was once again, pulled at the last minute.  I assume from "no resources to fix the animation". There is something wrong when Guardians and Strikers are badly out ranging you.

- Fix the long running and horrible bug on Shadow Kick so it behaves like every other skil with both Down Smash and Float.  Right now the Down Smash is incorrectly seen as a CC and adds a CC point often causing Immune state.  This screws up out many otherwise good melee combos..

- Give Shadow Kick range.  In today's game having a CC skill where you have to be touching the opponent to be within range is nuts.  What class in todays game are you ever going to be within touching distance of???

- Put the Down Smash back on Forward Darkness Released (controversal).

- Leave the Prime: Dark Flame at 6 secs CD and make it an SA.  Give Prime: Dark Flame real damage so it can be used effectively in isolation.  BUT adjust Succession: Ultimate Dark Flame so the its damage remains as it it is now.  Leave Succ: Ult: Dark Flame as an FG.

- Dark Flame is supposed to get an "increased range" when consuming a Shard.  Testing shows it is neither there or is so tiny it is not noticeable.  Eating a Shard is losing an Iframe and an Iframe is life.  Either fix the bug and increase the range from Shard consumption.  Or increase the damage from Shard consumption.  Or drop the Shard consumption.

- Remove the group AP buff off of Shards of Darkness, maybe reduce the buff,  and add it to Sinister Omen.  This will encourage your teammates to "fight around the Succ Sorc" instead of them just running off leaving you all alone in AoS etc without any movement capability to participate.  Consider dropping the Slow and adding back out DP self buff or Eva self buff when we are "unde the dome".

- Get rid of the SA on Abys Flame charged (it never works, I've never traded charged shots with an Archer or Awak Zerk and EVER CC'd them and NOT been CC'd by them) and change quick cast stiff to a stun.  The stiff is too short a duration to be taken advantage of.  A stun give us an opportunity to close in and re-CC and Combo.  Right now the stiff doesn't help at all.

- Adjust the CD on Dark Trade from 25s -> 20s.  Generally there are two situations.  A) you are there where the fight is and engaged and shard regen pretty much works, not OP, if you pay attention, but keeps you going when carefully manageed.  B)  Opponents are either running all over the map at distance, kiting or just moving the fight constantly away from you.  In this situation, you have no Shard Regen because you are not hitting anyone.  Getting a slightly faster refresh on Dark Trade can help you GET to the fight and reengage with your group BUT isn't going to make you OP when engaged. It will also enhance Disengage capablity, a current issue, without being OP.

- Flow of Darkness is nuts.  We now only get a 3% Eva buff and offers nothing else.  It is a very short side dash that is completely unprotected.  AND IT STILL COST 150 STAM.  150 Stam is the cost of a Woosa IFrame.    Drop the Stam cost or reduce to 50 Stam as we now only get a minor buff.  Doing this Skill for no other purpose than a minor buff with a 150 Stam cost makes no sense.  Give Succ Sorc a "side dash skill" to help with positioning.  The Flow Of Darkness -> Absolute Sinister Energy flow from one to the other is ok enough right now to do this without investing in animation rework.  Make Flow of Darkness into Abs Sinister Energy a viable side dash by making Flow of Darkness an SA and leave Abs Sinister Energy unprotected. Put our ACC buff on Abs Dark Energy as well but also leave the BUFF on Shadow Kick.  We would now have a side dash what is initially SA and gives both Acc and Eva buff in a single move.  Right now they are both do nothing skills we just keep spamming to get the buffs with the 150 stam penalty for a 3% Eva buff too onerous.

There are a TON of other things that can be done.  What is currently being proposed has made no one happy and doesn't really address any of our core issues.

Last Edit : Mar 18, 2025, 23:01 (UTC)
# 2
On: Mar 18, 2025, 22:24 (UTC), Written by Fionnia

Beyond the PVE damage buffs the current PVP patch is subpar.

Here are just a few small changes all or even just one of them that would have made a nice impact without being OP.

-  TBS have an SA.   Gives us a 2nd protected catch with Eruption remaining as SA.  This is not OP as Succ Sorc does not have a Grab, FG ignoring CC or Block Jump and classes have been buffed to have 100% SA protected rotations.  Succ Sorcs need "options".  It is not OP as often this would happen as a "skilled" manuever where you Stinger -cancel-> TBS behind someone when you see an opening.  You are still at risk from the unprotected Stinger, so not OP.

- Stinger as SA (but not with TBS as SA).  Similar thinking as above but slightly different Pro and Cons.  TBS with SA gives us a stronger but still vulnerable combo against a CC'd opponent in the face of "peeling" where your combo is attempted to be interrupted with a CC.  Stinger with SA give us better catch opportunities and better movement options fighting around the pack.

- Address movement issues by making Rushing a double cast within the cool down.  BUT to not make it OP only the FIRST cast is an SA.   The second cast within the cool down is unprotected.

- Simply increased the Range on Eruption which is very small for a Mid-Range class.  There is something wrong when Guardians and Strikers are badly out ranging you.

- Fix the long running and horrible bug on Shadow Kick so it behaves like every other skil with both Down Smash and Float.  Right now the Down Smash is incorrectly seen as a CC and adds a CC point often causing Immune state.  This screws up out many otherwise good melee combos..

- Give Shadow Kick range.  In today's game having a CC skill where you have to be touching the opponent to be within range is nuts.  What class in todays game are you ever going to be within touching distance of???

- Put the Down Smash back on Forward Darkness Released (controversal).

- Leave the Prime: Dark Flame at 6 secs CD and make it an SA.  Give Prime: Dark Flame real damage so it can be used effectively in isolation.  BUT adjust Succession: Ultimate Dark Flame so the its damage remains as it it is now.  Leave Succ: Ult: Dark Flame as an FG.

- Remove the group AP buff off of Shards of Darkness, maybe reduce the buff,  and add it to Sinister Omen.  This will encourage your teammates to "fight around the Succ Sorc" instead of them just running off leaving you all alone in AoS etc without any movement capability to participate.  Consider dropping the Slow and adding back out DP self buff or Eva self buff when we are "unde the dome".

- Get rid of the SA on Abys Flame charged (it never works, I've never traded charged shots with an Archer or Awak Zerk and EVER CC'd them and NOT been CC'd by them) and change quick cast stiff to a stun.  The stiff is too short a duration to be taken advantage of.  A stun give us an opportunity to close in and re-CC and Combo.  Right now the stiff doesn't help at all.

- Adjust the CD on Dark Trade from 25s -> 20s.  Generally there are two situations.  A) you are there where the fight is and engaged and shard regen pretty much works, not OP, if you pay attention, but keeps you going when carefully manageed.  B)  Opponents are either running all over the map at distance, kiting or just moving the fight constantly away from you.  In this situation, you have no Shard Regen because you are not hitting anyone.  Getting a slightly faster refresh on Dark Trade can help you GET to the fight and reengage with your group BUT isn't going to make you OP when engaged. It will also enhance Disengage capablity, a current issue, without being OP.

- Flow of Darkness is nuts.  We now only get a 3% Eva buff and offers nothing else.  It is a very short side dash that is completely unprotected.  AND IT STILL COST 150 STAM.  150 Stam is the cost of a Woosa IFrame.    Drop the Stam cost or reduce to 50 Stam as we now only get a minor buff.  Doing this Skill for no other purpose than a minor buff with a 150 Stam cost makes no sense.  Give Succ Sorc a "side dash skill" to help with positioning.  The Flow Of Darkness -> Absolute Sinister Energy flow from one to the other is ok enough right now to do this without investing in animation rework.  Make Flow of Darkness into Abs Sinister Energy a viable side dash by making Flow of Darkness an SA and leave Abs Sinister Energy unprotected. Put our ACC buff on Abs Dark Energy as well but also leave the BUFF on Shadow Kick.  We would now have a side dash what is initially SA and gives both Acc and Eva buff in a single move.  Right now they are both do nothing skills we just keep spamming to get the buffs with the 150 stam penalty for a 3% Eva buff too onerous.

There are a TON of other things that can be done.  What is currently being proposed has made no one happy and doesn't really address any of our core issues.

The more posts you make on the same topic isn't going to make them listen more

Last Edit : Mar 18, 2025, 23:54 (UTC)
# 3

They are on the same topic of Succ Sorc but are completely different.   

The first long post was detailed as to why the PROPOSED changes are very poor.  This second long post offered very modest, very easy to implement changes that addressed real issues with Succ Sorc. 

I deliberately left off BIG improvements as others are already posting about them and lets be honest PA is not going to do BIG changes.  Knockdown on Dark Flame ain't never coming back.  The changes I proposed above are pretty nuanced unless one has put in some hours on Succ Sorc, but they will incrementally improve Succ Sorc.  In other words, maybe these have a shot.

And to be honest if making 2 posts, one as to why a GL patch is bad and one as to how to make a GL post better., is too much, then what is the point of this forum anyway?

And as a final point, Succ Sorc has gone years without any attention by PA.  After this brief moment the spec will probably not get any attention again for another 5 years.  If 5 posts now gets even the slightest improvement over the crappy path in GL then I'm happy to post again and again and again.  Waste of time.  Most likely.  Only shot we will have for another half decade.  More likely.  So might as well pull out all the stops and go for it.

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