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Shai Donkey as an hybrid invocation
30 abr. 2024, 12:26 (UTC)
270 13
1 2
Última modificación : 01 may. 2024, 08:04 (UTC)
# 1

Family Name: Daiikkii 

Region (NA/EU): EU

Suggestions/Comments: 


Black Desert Online has captivated many of us, but recent updates have diminished one of its distinctive features—the Shai Donkey. Initially introduced as a companion to the Shai character, the donkey's utility has declined significantly since 2019 where it was described like this in the patch note " Shai has always had a donkey companion, ever since she was young. She knows how to better handle donkeys, and she can travel fast while mounting one." . And here's why:

The Decline in Utility:

  1. Celestial Horse Calling Horn: Initially, the donkey's key advantage was its ability to be summoned anywhere on the map, setting it apart from horses. However, with the introduction of the Celestial Horse Calling Horn, horses now offer the same convenience, rendering the donkey's unique calling feature obsolete.

  2. Monster Avoidance: The donkey was also known for not being attacked by monsters. However, mounts can now level up beyond most monsters, making this feature redundant.

  3. Lack of Advancement: The Shai Donkey's abilities have remained stagnant, despite significant changes in the game. Its original lore describes it as a trusty companion, yet recent updates have left it lagging behind.

Proposed Rework:

To restore the Shai Donkey's relevance, I propose the following:

  1. Following Command: Allow the donkey to follow the Shai character, even when she's riding a horse, similar to the Tamer's summoning. A command should be included to control its movement (for exemple: asking him to not move).

  2. Buffs and Bonuses: Equip the donkey with buffs like increased LT, reduced damage, evasion passive, and gathering bonuses. These align with the donkey's life skill support role and ensure its relevance.

  3. Gear Reworked: Either remove the current gear, leaving only the outfit, but buff the donkey to compensate for the lack of gear, or replace it with gear that can't be upgraded but matches Krogdalo's +10 gear in stats, and more easily acquired. This would make the donkey a viable, laid-back, and chilled-out alternative between horse uses.

  4. Storage Capacity: Make the donkey's storage capacity to 25-30 slots 12 with nearly infinite LT, allowing it to serve as a "mule" for life skills. This would allow it to compete with horses that can transfer infinite LT items in one slot directly from character to mount.

  5. Trade Restrictions: To balance its storage capacity, trade items should be excluded from these slots unless the trade system is revised and make this feature acceptable.

Respecting the Shai Donkey's Identity:

As Pearl Abyss envisioned it, these improvements would maintain the donkey's unique link to the Shai character,  keeping it tied to life skills and preventing it from becoming another horse clone. Because right now, who could proudly say that their Shai have always a donkey companion with them, like it was described in 2019 ?

Conclusion:

The Shai character and her donkey are in dire need of a rework. The recent sharing of professional skills across characters has diminished the Shai's distinct gathering and alchemy roles, making the donkey's life skill support all the more crucial. Let's give the Shai Donkey a place back in our adventures, restoring its unique position in the world of Black Desert Online.

PS: There is actually a protest since the 24 april at heidel,  medhia 1 channel explaining the needs of the Shai. 
Shai Protest April 24th Med 1 Heidel


Trailer of the Shai with her Donkey following her:

Now Shai = musical Instrument/buff
In 2019 Shai = Donkey

Última modificación : 30 abr. 2024, 12:54 (UTC)
# 2
This is exactly how I dream of the donkey.

There are a few secondary points I would like to add:

First point, If only we had a quest sequence allowing us to gradually improve the donkey's abilities,
this would make it more attractive and up-to-date.

Second point, I am a Shai player. I have 4 that I love. But I'm always so frustrated not to be able to have Shai's 3 different donkeys,
because according to the game having one is the limit. Why? We can have as many dream horses as we want. Even if I made 4 Shai, I am only allowed one Shai donkey per family.

Last point, I completely agree with the chapter on donkey equipment:"3-Conserve customizable Gear" The Krogdalo and Granverre gear are the only gears currently allowing you to make the donkey decent
(and even then, not that much...) and yet they are absurd to craft in terms of difficulty,
and made obsolete with previous updates .

Thanks to read me and sorry for my english
MAKE DONKEY GREAT PLEASE !

Última modificación : 30 abr. 2024, 12:56 (UTC)
# 3

Don't let this be the end of our story!!!
-->

Última modificación : 30 abr. 2024, 15:15 (UTC)
# 4

1: why you would want your donkey to follow you around?  Just for the meme?  You can already call it with a flute or horn.

2: asking to remove the gear is going to piss off the people who worked so hard to get the krogdalo gear.  suggest making the krog gear easier to get.

3:  25-30 inventory slots for a donkey?  So it should hold more than an elephant?  

We have so many people complaining that they want Shai to be a normal class.  Then these posts pop up asking to keep Shai a meme/lifeskiller/buffer class.  The Shai protest you link is also about making Shai a normal class and not a meme/buffer.

109 942
Lv Privado
Picklenose
Última modificación : 30 abr. 2024, 16:28 (UTC)
# 5
  • Q: "Why would you want your donkey to follow you around?"

    A: The donkey is an integral part of the Shai's lore, much like Heilong is to the Tamer. In the patch notes introducing the Shai, it states: "Shai has always had a donkey companion, ever since she was young. She knows how to better handle donkeys, and she can travel fast while mounting one." The Tamer can have Heilong follow her even when riding a horse, so why not extend the same privilege to the Shai? Currently, you can't have both a horse and a donkey, which undermines the lore.

  • Q: "Asking to remove the gear is going to upset those who worked hard for the Krogdalo gear. Suggest making the Krogdalo gear easier to get."

    A: Please refer to my initial proposal in full. I provided two options: one to remove the gear and offer buffs to compensate, and another to introduce gear that replace krogdalo's (too outdated buff..) that can't be upgraded but matches Krogdalo's +10 gear in stats. Gear Already acquired would be replaced directly. But yes, I must point out that the difficulty of acquiring the new gear should also be lowered. Thanks.

  • Q: "25-30 inventory slots for a donkey? So it should hold more than an elephant?"

    A: Good argument! I appreciate your input. I see now that 25-30 slots might be excessive. Staying at 12 slots seems sufficient.

  • Q: "We have so many people complaining that they want Shai to be a normal class. Then these posts pop up asking to keep Shai a meme/life-skiller/buffer class. The Shai protest you link is also about making Shai a normal class and not a meme/buffer."

    A: The Shai does need a rework to be better at PvE and PvP without being reduced to a buff bot. However, I think it's crucial to preserve her essence as stated in her lore. This is what the Shai is. This could be more debated in the "Shai Protest April 24th Med 1 Heidel" topic.
    For my topic, I also want to add that with the donkey nearby and not targeted by monsters, it would be much easier to use it for storing trash loot in PvE, while still having the option to use the horse for quickly heading to a city.

    I don't want the donkey to be as fast as an horse, I don't want wings on it, I don't want to deal damage with it, I just want to use my horse whitout having to abandon my donkey.

Última modificación : 30 abr. 2024, 16:36 (UTC)
# 6
On: Apr 30, 2024, 15:52 (UTC), Written by Daiikkii
  • Q: "Why would you want your donkey to follow you around?"

    A: The donkey is an integral part of the Shai's lore, much like Heilong is to the Tamer. In the patch notes introducing the Shai, it states: "Shai has always had a donkey companion, ever since she was young. She knows how to better handle donkeys, and she can travel fast while mounting one." The Tamer can have Heilong follow her even when riding a horse, so why not extend the same privilege to the Shai? Currently, you can't have both a horse and a donkey, which undermines the lore.

    Lore or not, Heuklang for Tamer is a necessity for grinding.  Tamer is gimped without its pet.   Shai not having a donkey changes nothing.  This isn't a valid argument.

  • Q: "Asking to remove the gear is going to upset those who worked hard for the Krogdalo gear. Suggest making the Krogdalo gear easier to get."

    A: Please refer to my initial proposal in full. I provided two options: one to remove the gear and offer buffs to compensate, and another to introduce gear that replace krogdalo's (too outdated buff..) that can't be upgraded but matches Krogdalo's +10 gear in stats. Gear Already acquired would be replaced directly. But yes, I must point out that the difficulty of acquiring the new gear should also be lowered. Thanks.

    Again, you take away that Krog gear and just blanket give every shai the krog buff, you're going to piss off those people who worked so hard to get the krog gear.  Is this new gear going to be the same difficulty to acquire?  

109 942
Lv Privado
Picklenose
Última modificación : 30 abr. 2024, 18:08 (UTC)
# 7

Q: "Lore or not, Heuklang for Tamer is a necessity for grinding. Tamer is gimped without its pet. Shai not having a donkey changes nothing. This isn't a valid argument."

A: The Heuklang's utility is crucial to the Tamer's gameplay, but the donkey's significance extends beyond pure mechanics. The donkey embodies the Shai's connection to life skills and embodies its character's essence. While the donkey's lack doesn't cripple the Shai's grinding potential in the same way, its absence detracts from the character's identity and world immersion. Restoring the donkey's relevance through features like buffs, inventory support, and making it an hybrid invocation enhances both gameplay and lore, keeping the Shai's unique flavor intact.

Q: "Again, you take away that Krog gear and just blanket give every Shai the Krog buff, you're going to piss off those people who worked so hard to get the Krog gear. Is this new gear going to be the same difficulty to acquire?"

A: I understand and appreciate this concern. The new gear's acquisition should balance gameplay progression, respecting the efforts of those who invested in Krogdalo's gear. However, Pearl Abyss has recently made many items really easier to obtain, such as the Frigate, Forest Path Wagon, musical instruments, Infinite Potion, and PEN gear. Given this, why shouldn't the donkey's equipment follow suit? Additionally, Donkey Krogdalo's gear is outdated since 2019, necessitating buffs; that's why I proposed a full rework and Yes, making it easier to acquire. I have now pointed out the difficulty in my initial comment thanks to your comment about it. So I'm thankfull for your help. 

EDIT: Now that I think about it, how many of those who worked hard to get the Krogdalo gear have abandoned their donkey for their free Dream Horse or T10 horse? They would likely be thankful if they could use both, giving purpose to the long hours spent making their donkey better.

Última modificación : 30 abr. 2024, 17:08 (UTC)
# 8

Shai can sit backwards and lie down on the donkey already. It wouldn't be weird to have more immersive/fun features like that for the donkey with Shai, such as being able to follow. I agree 100% that donkey was originally Shai's companion similar to how Heilang was for Tamer. 

Shai Trailer
At 1:17 of the Shai trailer it literally shows donkey following shai. I am one of the few people that wasn't entirely happy when Shai was allowed to ride regular horses (I wasn't upset about it per se either) but I was worried that the change was the start of making the donkey obsolete. And sure enough, donkey feels all around forgotten after that point. I think allowing the donkey to follow Shai while she has her actual horse out is probably one of the best ideas to resolve the issue that the donkey became borderline useless when Shai was allowed to ride regular horses.

A lot of the time I want to ride donkey on my shai, but I have a hard time justifying it because of how useless the donkey is. Allowing the donkey to follow shai is the first step towards making the donkey relavant again. Of course, the next step being to actually buff the donkey so it has real value to Shai beyond the fun/immersive features.

Última modificación : 30 abr. 2024, 17:20 (UTC)
# 9
On: Apr 30, 2024, 15:52 (UTC), Written by Daiikkii
  • Q: "Why would you want your donkey to follow you around?"

    A: The donkey is an integral part of the Shai's lore, much like Heilong is to the Tamer. In the patch notes introducing the Shai, it states: "Shai has always had a donkey companion, ever since she was young. She knows how to better handle donkeys, and she can travel fast while mounting one." The Tamer can have Heilong follow her even when riding a horse, so why not extend the same privilege to the Shai? Currently, you can't have both a horse and a donkey, which undermines the lore.

  • Q: "Asking to remove the gear is going to upset those who worked hard for the Krogdalo gear. Suggest making the Krogdalo gear easier to get."

    A: Please refer to my initial proposal in full. I provided two options: one to remove the gear and offer buffs to compensate, and another to introduce gear that replace krogdalo's (too outdated buff..) that can't be upgraded but matches Krogdalo's +10 gear in stats. Gear Already acquired would be replaced directly. But yes, I must point out that the difficulty of acquiring the new gear should also be lowered. Thanks.

  • Q: "25-30 inventory slots for a donkey? So it should hold more than an elephant?"

    A: Good argument! I appreciate your input. I see now that 25-30 slots might be excessive. Staying at 12 slots seems sufficient.

  • Q: "We have so many people complaining that they want Shai to be a normal class. Then these posts pop up asking to keep Shai a meme/life-skiller/buffer class. The Shai protest you link is also about making Shai a normal class and not a meme/buffer."

    A: The Shai does need a rework to be better at PvE and PvP without being reduced to a buff bot. However, I think it's crucial to preserve her essence as stated in her lore. This is what the Shai is. This could be more debated in the "Shai Protest April 24th Med 1 Heidel" topic.
    For my topic, I also want to add that with the donkey nearby and not targeted by monsters, it would be much easier to use it for storing trash loot in PvE, while still having the option to use the horse for quickly heading to a city.

    I don't want the donkey to be as fast as an horse, I don't want wings on it, I don't want to deal damage with it, I just want to use my horse whitout having to abandon my donkey.

I agree with you. I think the Shai can be reworked to be an actual class. But not to where it sacrifices her very identity. Being reworked into a full-fledged class shouldn't remove her uniqueness. I think you can have both (unique and a full fleshed out class). We shouldn't have to choose between one or the other. I feel a class can be unique but still fit into the games roles or design. I was also disappointed when our donkey could not follow our Shai like in the trailer. I mean Heilang can follow Tamer while we use other mounts, they could work in something similar for the donkey for Shai. I don't see the harm as long as Donkey serves a passive role, much like a pet would (which you've stated). I just wish Pearl Abyss would do this for ALL classes. Focus on what makes each one unique and expand on it. For Shai, their donkey is an important part of her. As well as her supportive role, which still should be adjusted but not eliminated. She should be able to stand on her own (for solo questing/grinding/PvP) same as the others but able to support her allies as needed (but still be able to do more than just 'stand around and buff'). I think they need to go 'back to the drawing board' so to speak with Shai. Work on how they can make Shai into a class without taking away from what makes her special and rework her to fit or integrate into the game better and be a bit more versatile (which Shai are if you think about it, they adapt just as readily as humans in the game). This game is not designed for a full support class (similar to Priest in Tera). Witch and Valkyrie are support oriented but they do so much more than just stand around and buff or heal. Give Shai succession and awakening same as all the other classes. Succession could be more dps focused with her awakening more support focused.

Última modificación : 30 abr. 2024, 17:56 (UTC)
# 10
Écrit le : 30 avr. 2024, 17:08 (UTC), par : Ventesa

Shai can sit backwards and lie down on the donkey already. It wouldn't be weird to have more immersive/fun features like that for the donkey with Shai, such as being able to follow. I agree 100% that donkey was originally Shai's companion similar to how Heilang was for Tamer. 

Shai Trailer
At 1:17 of the Shai trailer it literally shows donkey following shai. I am one of the few people that wasn't entirely happy when Shai was allowed to ride regular horses (I wasn't upset about it per se either) but I was worried that the change was the start of making the donkey obsolete. And sure enough, donkey feels all around forgotten after that point. I think allowing the donkey to follow Shai while she has her actual horse out is probably one of the best ideas to resolve the issue that the donkey became borderline useless when Shai was allowed to ride regular horses.

A lot of the time I want to ride donkey on my shai, but I have a hard time justifying it because of how useless the donkey is. Allowing the donkey to follow shai is the first step towards making the donkey relavant again. Of course, the next step being to actually buff the donkey so it has real value to Shai beyond the fun/immersive features.

Oh my god someone who hasn't forgotten the trailer ! I love it !

Écrit le : 30 avr. 2024, 17:11 (UTC), par : Nissa

I agree with you. I think the Shai can be reworked to be an actual class. But not to where it sacrifices her very identity. Being reworked into a full-fledged class shouldn't remove her uniqueness. I think you can have both (unique and a full fleshed out class). We shouldn't have to choose between one or the other. I feel a class can be unique but still fit into the games roles or design. I was also disappointed when our donkey could not follow our Shai like in the trailer. I mean Heilang can follow Tamer while we use other mounts, they could work in something similar for the donkey for Shai. I don't see the harm as long as Donkey serves a passive role, much like a pet would (which you've stated). I just wish Pearl Abyss would do this for ALL classes. Focus on what makes each one unique and expand on it. For Shai, their donkey is an important part of her. As well as her supportive role, which still should be adjusted but not eliminated. She should be able to stand on her own (for solo questing/grinding/PvP) same as the others but able to support her allies as needed (but still be able to do more than just 'stand around and buff'). I think they need to go 'back to the drawing board' so to speak with Shai. Work on how they can make Shai into a class without taking away from what makes her special and rework her to fit or integrate into the game better and be a bit more versatile (which Shai are if you think about it, they adapt just as readily as humans in the game). This game is not designed for a full support class (similar to Priest in Tera). Witch and Valkyrie are support oriented but they do so much more than just stand around and buff or heal. Give Shai succession and awakening same as all the other classes. Succession could be more dps focused with her awakening more support focused.


I agree that Shai's rework should preserve her unique identity while integrating into the game's roles! The donkey following the Shai would honor her lore. Additionally, the Shai should have more solo capabilities, balancing her support role with self-sufficiency. However, I hesitate at the idea of a standard awakening, as it may revert to a buff bot role. An alternative could be a hybrid class, blending her current supportive abilities with more conventional mechanics. The "Shai Protest April 24th Med 1 Heidel" topic offers some good ideas for how to achieve this (10 minutes buff with 9min cooldowns, passive evasion...).


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