Shattering has a frontal guard, though. This new cluster looks like its currently unprotected, it would probably be way more useful if they added a protection but it would suck to have it replace shattering as is.

Yeah, appart from the seed cd (which still have higher CD for the follow which is nonsense), the rework is insignificant. It ain't really gonna change anything, and given how large buffs some of the already overperforming classes got, the reworks wil actually going to make this class weaker than it already is.

But this is what older palyers expected. I remember when they announced the reworks ppl memed that they will just end up buffing the striker even more, and who could've guesed that they will be right kek...

Just reroll or find a different game. PA can't ballance, but mostlikely doesn't even want to.

I made a thread in the wrong area but I wanted to chip in a general idea. With Imperious command there should be more skills that apply the dot but the dot itself should also do more damage and/or at least come with added utility when used with other skills e.g. life-steal when used with Spirit Saturation (which is another skill that needs to be looked at), added movement/attack speed when used with Vedir's Dogma which also gives some sort of slow or accuaracy debuff to the enemy and explosive aoe/bleed dot when used with the Imperious Command input (snappy fingers). The kind of buffs/debuffs you can apply could even change in awakening if need be. In terms of the numbers/percentages applied to buff/debuff I don't know but there's a lot they can do to add some layers to the class.

Very much disagree. I personally believe shattering to be the most core ability of awa DKs kit, and losing it for the new cluster skill would be a hard nerf. Id rather either have new cluster as a seperate skill entirely, or it not exist.

I promised I would also be adding a more general feedback on the reworks here. Alas, I got done writing.

Feedback on DK Reboot

General Issues

DK is currently facing a number of issues, which are caused by several classes being far ahead in the PvE aspects of the game in relation to the majority of other classes, the prevalence of the so called "shield meta" (Shield classes being favoured in a lot of matchups/ compositions) as well as Grab / Perma SA meta (a high number of classes has full SA or protected rotations, which can often only be broken with grab; with the addition of multiple strong or ranged or just extremely fast / protected grabs to the game in recent years).

I already posted my list of DKs issues in the quoted posts. The following list will show my issues specifically with the rework.

1. Equalised PvE

For Awakening, changes in PvE boil down to: Addition of Grip as a Pulling skill, Addition of Touch for HP Sustain, Addition of Cluster as a Damage Skill, Reduction of Seed / Root CD. In a vaccuum, all of these changes are good and will somewhat improve our PvE. However, it also comes along with the Removal of Cluster as a Pulling skill (it was especially useful at range, which we would now need to use Seed for), as well as the removal of a spammable T3 Skill addon. Due to cluster being a long CD of 12 seconds, the Downtime on some addons will increase by almost twice, which is a big loss in effect. Additionally, Grip as an AoE pulling skill does not make up for the range lost with cluster, especially since the AoE of Cluster does not seem to be much further than Mobs would usually aggro on the player due to being in range. Using seed as a pulling skill instead means giving up a lot of damage during the combo, which also will end up as a negative. New Cluster does not do as much damage as seed does, while also taking much longer to cast, essentially being vulnerable during that cast period. We may still see a slight increase in trash due to all of the above skills, but it will by far not be enough to equalise PvE across the board, and falls behind other PvE buffs for other class reboots we've seen. For succession, the AoE increase for Wheel, Lunacy and Rake, additional to the Airstrike flow will increase combo damage and allow us to attack more mobs at once. Here, the PvE buffs are much more substantial, though I still do not believe it will be enough to catch up with the classes that are currently pulling ahead. However, Filler damage is still lacking, and you often find yourself waiting for the strong damage skills, or even for any useable skill. These downtimes where you just lack skills for DPS decrease trash/hr quite substantially. In addition, while succ had a PvE HP regen before Awa did (with this rework), it has far less FG uptime than awa. This makes grinding in hard hitting spots much more difficult, and can also lead to loss of efficiency, as the player needs to evade much more, while in awa they could block the incoming damage with FGs.

2. Revamp Unused Skills

The following unused skills were addressed: Grip of Grudge, Touch of Exploitation, Repeated Annihilation, Corrupt Ground, Absolute: Obsidian Ashes (Prime version was used), Luscious Snare (debatable if unused, but devs seemed to think so). Not addressed were: Vedir's dogma, Sudden Attack, Darkness Burst, Imperious Command, Scarring Slash, Unclosed Scar, Spirit Satiation, All BSR skills, Soul Snatch, Unveiled Fate, Obsidian Blaze, Slanted Slash. As evident from this list, the number of skills that are in desperate need of another look are still very high. In their current state, none of these skills enjoy any purpose in combat, other than extremely situational use in case absolutely no other skill is available. Most of these skills are forever locked, or just not used. Now, lets look at the skills that were touched. 1. Grip of Grudge: Increased AoE & Damage: While it was nice, the skill is still slow, and does much less damage than the tooltip suggests, even when capping out on crit rate to make up for the low crit rate of the skill. The AoE also seems to split up its hit along the range, making the damage very low when hitting multiple mobs. As stated above, the size of the AoE still does not make the skill into a good pulling skill. While it may be used to fill some holes in our CDs in awakening, especially while having an Elvia weapon effect, it will still not be a good skill to use for damage in combos in PvE due to the low damage/cast time. PvP is still not an option with this skill. 2. Touch of Exploitation: Adding the FG on the skill finally made one change that DKs in awa desperately needed, and that is some sort of HP sustain. The FG is extremely useful on the skill to not lose more HP than you regenerate while casting the skill. All the other changes, like a larger AoE, faster cast time and more damage slightly make up for the loss of DPS while using the skill, but essentially i'm fine with the skill by now. If a DK needs additional heals, the skill provides that on a fairly low CD. If a DK would rather use pots/elixirs to heal, they will be more efficient. Thats an acceptable tradeoff. Overall, a good change to an unused skill 3. Repeated Annihilation: The skill was remade into a flow to Nocturne. Essentially adding 2 slashes after being invisible while in noct. It has added a damage slash (unprotected) and an instant float. While these new slashes are pretty nice, it has little to do with the previous skill. That doesnt really matter though, so I guess its also a fine addition, even if it leaves a bad taste afterwards. It cannot be used while in awakening stance, which so far I hope to be a bug. 4. Corrupt Ground: AoE & Cast Speed increase. Both are ok changes, but the skill still does too little damage, still is too slow, still applies a useless PvP CC (DKs are bad for capitalising on Stuns due to a lot of skills with floats/down attack modifiers. It doesnt do enough damage in PvX to make it worth to use and risk being killed / CCd / damaged while in the animation 5. Absolute: Obsidian Ashes: Basically the same issue as CG. Lack of damage, no protection, no CC. Dashing towards the enemy in an unprotected animation is still asking to die, while buring an important CD. The only use for this would be in PvE pulling, but the projectile is not very responsive to aiming, especially when using the smokey interaction 6. Snare: Casting the skill onto yourself when using the quickslot version makes it more predictable than the current state of the skill. Using the dusk interaction burns an important CD, and leaves you unprotected for a full second, while not even being far enough away from the opponent to be worth the risk. Stun still is a bad CC to capitalise on, and even if you catch someone with the trap, you are stuck in the animation for a second before you can do anything about it. Overall, it does not seem to be worthwhile to use.

3. Lack of Passives Rebalancing

In the first few reboots, we saw some party buffs, self buffs etc. being added to classes, which are lacking in the current reboots. However, passives, especially those deemed generally "low impact" like Tamer's Weight passive, were never reevaluated. This includes the Movement Speed passive of Succession Dark knight, which barely fills any purpose and feels like an empty slot. DK severely lacks self buffs or utility for herself / her party. Adding passives that can be used to debuff enemies / buff allies would be a nice additional touch to make her kit feel a lot more coherent.

4. No change to issues the class had in PvP

Other than the Seed CD change, and Split dusk, Awakening PvP has changed very little. Added skills have only a very limited use in PvP due to them being unprotected, and only one of them having a CC (Nocturne Float). These changes will not make up for the issues we currently face against shield and gauntlet classes. While it might help in some form against their current versions, with the way reworks are currently on some of these classes (Warrior, Striker, Valkyrie), the 1v1 matchup against these classes actually suffers. In large scale, bashing against a full group of such classes will still make our skills amount to next to nothing, and DKs situation in PvP overall will not improve. The changes might however make the matchup of classes that struggle against us even more oppressive, though not by a large margin (reworks are still to be considered). For Succession, the change to kama interactions, the addition of airstrike flow for long range mobility, the increase of AoE sizes and split dusk may also help a little against shield /gauntlet classes, but also by far not enough to equalise the matchup at least slightly. It will however strongly buff DK in matchups she struggles far less. In the end, I feel like the actual issues of DKs in PvP were not really addressed, in favour of flashy changes that "look" like something changed, with little viability or use in PvP. The class still feels somewhat lacking in a lot of aspects, especially in PvP.

These reworks have (soo far) not really lived up to the definition of what a "rework" actually is.

These all seem to be absolutely random buffs that no one has really asked for, whilst not addressing the actual issues with older classes feeling clunky and possessing skills with zero thought into them on release.

The new cluster skill is.. idk honestly...
I'm glad it has retained its t3 add on status with a decent CD considering it is a t3 skill, it could potentially be easier to apply it, than the on-demand niche t3 add on skill that it currently serves as (pve+pvp), but why did they replace cluster with this skill, rather than something that is LITERALLY useless and never used (soul snatch????) lmao.

This class really does need a rework, it is inconsistent as hell, the ranged hits sometimes don't even register due to a tiny bit of movement from the enemy or the player's camera, gated behind CDs that only allow her to succeed at random times (against select classes) with burst damage and a dice roll every 2s on dusk actually working properly.

The modifiers need to be adjusted a lot (or just freakin remove the stupid modifiers altogether), we either deal a large amount of damage (mostly to unplayed classes like musa/maewha, tamer and sorc), or we do literally nothing and have to sit out for 12 seconds before attempting a play again, because our melee skills are still terrible.

I have more to say about this class, I've played it for far too long now, but this is it until the rest of the rework is completed.

So looks like we dying in 3 secs to every single class but Shai still. And all of our attacks have chains around them so we don't deal damage to players. Fun times.

Like legit 90% of all DK attacks are useless. LMAO

Don't worry, the 62lvl forum pro DK gonna explain you that DK is suppa good, just need bigger  booba.

My personal bet DK die in 3 sec because DP/DR don't applyed or very capped on special attacks, somewhere when they nerfed DK's PVP damage they mistakenly/intention also capped DP/DR but there is no way to prove it.

I want all my outfits converted to Cosair. If DK can't be 2017 good ever again just refund me my outfits.

I feel like I should just make a YouTube video of different classes doing basic attacks to show how weak DK is because she's made of paper.

And just end it with 5 mins of me trying to heal using her heal (without pots.)

PVP for DK is so bad in 2021 that Karma Bombing is PVP. If they say Duel for spot say. "No, Im a DK so you will have to go red and then some class that is a PVP class can jail you. If you don't like that then complain to PA about how DK's wont duel you because they can't ever win."

Remember the good old days when we could BLOCK and then when they exhausted themselves of stamina or were on cool downs we could launch our Nukes & they would DIE!?! Good times.