Is there going to be a balance between the states at anytime soon? I feel... after getting 1100 accuracy would mean u can accurately fight people appropriately, but just getting 1300 Eva and they just auto win with 281 ap, even 401dp and up... it's not... reflecting for accuracy base classes like sage, guardian etc dp gear isn't balancing out with accuracy and this like getting... pen turo, pen revived necklace, and an ominous ring pen, they can kill you, you cant kill them.

I feel like PA has no idea what to do with Evasion so they just turn a blind eye to it and say "this is fine".

Evasion vs Accuracy

They be melting each other. But the problem isn't about how much x amount of accuracy is needed to melt +420DP evasion and not get melted by 281AP when playing DR. The main problem is DR is just poor defense compare to evasion. 

The reason i think evasion has better defense is because many classes has % base evasion multiplier; like 9% from using skill, +3% from using same skill with addon (so 12%) and class passive having +10% evasion and gears providing more evasion where as DR is just fixed digit, +20DR and +20DR from class passive or 0 DR if class has no DR passive.

DR is just flat % base damage reduction whereas evasion is chance (RNG)% base damage evasion. So, it's quite easy to fight against DR because it depends on how much AP you have whereas it becomes extreamly hard to fight against evasion because you need AP & Accuracy both to fight against them.

So it is important that when you are dueling against evasion with DR gear, try to have as much DR on you gear ( i use +6 DR passive in my belt (cup item) & 2 Narc earings)... when when you CC a player, its very important to apply DR & evasion debuff & accuracy buff before you start dishing out high dmg skills.

I have stated this on multiple other threads...

DR BUILDS DO NOT EQUAL DEFENSE..

DR BUILDS are in fact Accuracy/offence builds everyone keeps getting this mixed up.

Evasion builds are in fact tank/defence builds.

Dr does mitigate damage but it was truly ment for being able to take hits directly while in SA/FG.. DR loses at the point you add in MODIFIERS to ANY OTHER BUILD.  Back attack,down attack, air attack, Critical all of which are damage by %. Because you do not have enough Evasion you end up getting hit 100% of the time. 

You want to be a tank then go evasion it works even on non evasion classes.

If you want to kill then go DR but also remember your a glass cannon. No matter how much DR YOU PUT ON you will never reach a level were you wont take damage.. 

Case in point Pure black stone DR Adds 1000dr though it takes 10 players to kill you you still die were add that to a evasion build and your unkillable.

STOP adding more DR to a DR build like Cadre rings, narcs ect. And switch to accuracy and AP and allow your armour to carry you i.e. c20+ and Fallen god duo+ to help use gemming proper to your situation. 

For the love of God stop treating DR as a tank build. 

Giving this advice as someone with a  - self-ground and self-made Pen Lunar, Turo, one Omi and one Dawn + a c14 accuracy offhand - that's about to sell all of that useless junk. Every single of these gains I made, I was like "ok...finally after the next one, ill be able to smoke eva apes just as much as they smoke me". It did not happen. It probably would happen if I played one of the mentioned classes below, but the fact that you can deal the exact same damage (to evasion players) with full Accuracy vs full Eva (but the right class) is just atrocious. Also, compounding is the fact that you can buy Evasion gear for 20-50% less the cost to gain WAY MORE Survivability (at least 100% more), as opposed to the damage you gain by adding Accuracy to your build (which is usually 1-5% more damage vs full evasion).

I'll give you the solution, you just won't like it.

Step 1. Swap to Sage/Drak/Witch/Zerk/Stroker (and several others) which benefit from 36-44% (Accuracy Buff/Evasion Shred) along with 20-50% Accuracy Modifiers on their skills.

Step 2. Swap all of your insanely expensive Accuracy Accessories worth 100-150b each, for insanely cheap 1300 evasion gear. You'll probably have billions left over after that to theory-craft or do something in the game you never thought you would. Trust me, evasion is a better counter to evasion than accuracy - why go for 1-5% more damage when you can get 50-200% more survivability?

Step 3. Bash everyone in RBF while being borderline immortal yourself - ofc except against classes with insane accuracy modifiers (while rocking full evasion) like yourself.o7

Step 4. Pleasure. Enjoy being another evasion monkey.*

Step 5. Go on forums and Reddit and use the following lines"Evasion is fine!" "DR is just the dps build and evasion is the tanky build" "You don't understand, Evasion is not the problem, the problem is DR not being strong enough" or my favorite "Evasion only works on classes with good evasion modifiers" "Evasion is capped in NW (played by 1% of the playerbase), so it shouldn't be changed in any way or form" . Even though the aforementioned classes deal more damage with the "tanky" evasion build than you ever will with any DR/Dmg/Accuracy build, vs evasion targets even. Even though high evasion is incrementally easier to reach compared to high accuracy. Even though evasion works just fine (one might argue that it even works better) on DR (stat-centric) classes.

Another solution would be to simply increase the Accuracy gains by gear piece to match the cost of gains with Evasion. But that would require devs to actually try out their game.

-

*Hopefully, every single player that plays any OW/RBF pvp in BDO is going to follow this guide at one point, so that it's only the same 4-5 classes just missing against each, nobody being able to kill anybody else.

Adding 16 accuracy (aka 4%) to Elkar's won't change shit for pvp and most players at endgame already cap accuracy so they won't change a thing there either. Mayhaps it will at crypt, but you could just grind with a shai or an accuracy meta class with insane modifiers to skip this need altogether. Overall, you can build a 1Trillion gearset with accuracy to reach ONLY 1100 accuracy and miss 30% of the time vs an evasion player with 1300eva who spent 300b less than you or has 300b-worth of more DR or AP than you in armor or accessories, while gitting you 100% of the time. #balanced

Never once things were fine in the game...

The title of this thread is "Accuracy vs Evasion" 

Yet OP's comments are about balancing between them that is NOT what this thread is about OP doesn't even get it.

My response was in SPECIFIC relation to a completely false comment and its getting old seeing it.

But my statments stand, within the confines of our CURRENT mechanics specifically speaking tank builds are in fact evasion builds and your right 1300 evasion is a starting point.

Can you over come specific evasion builds with all accuracy on some classes ABSOLUTELY ranger being one of them(they can 1 combo a 1390 evasion meagu) as in relation to using best in slot gear in some cases using a accuracy offhand is much more flexible way to gain 100+ accuracy and this is even better when you toss on Pen debo neck and belt followed by at least 1 or 2 Pen Distortions.

But as I have stated in previous threads the higher your accuracy the lower your damage will be when some of these classes your describing are also Tet fallen god, c20 boots and have the DR backing there evasion. 

This is why we build for the avg. Not the top end 95% of your fights will be against normal opponents the top 5% you won't see often outside of NW/Siege . If I come across guys like diveos or others with strikers that are completely over geared and a class that is SUPER TANKY can't be killed by 3 to 5 people but can kill all around them cuz they do WAAAY too much damage at lower ap. Literally I will just ignore these guys and kill all there friends kinda hard to fight alone.

At some point the amount of accuracy may give you 100% hit rate but if your 280ap your not gonna hurt a 740gs player.

Is this fair? Obviously if I have problems killing at 1300+ evasion hash were this hash still has the damage to kill 90% of all DR builds 410dp+ in a combo even after there accuracy was nerfed. Makes you scratch your head.

But again not all players are like this and not all of them are good at there class. Others are god tier sometimes you just need to be realistic with your game play and there is nothing wrong with tagging a new class.

perma SA valk player saying DR is fine, bro stop it, DR is trash, DR+ super armor is OP because you immune to CC and take no special damage that ignore DR.

As for topic, accuracy is a joke as you just have classes that have raw % evasion on top all of this while accuracy cost like insane and evasion is basically given you for free.

If you anyone want any changes  stop asking for them, force PA to show combat logs.

I actually don't use DR for my valk I use evasion.

I swapped over some time ago.. specifically I main both meagu and Succ valk both use same build with tweaks. VALK is strong on evasion.

Funny that you feel called out when I didn't call you out specifically. The thread is what OP imagined it to be, not what YOU or the "Official BDO Nomenclature" is. If you think they are wrong according to the nomenclature, you are free to correct them. Your posts just make you look like one more evasion shill tho.

I don't get what you're argument is in this one, or what you're arguing for. However, 100 accuracy {from accuracy offhand} doesn't do shit to even the avg evasion player (let alone the endest game one) due to many reasons - not the least of which is the fact that an evasion offhand gives 33 (aka 5%) more evasion than you get with the accuracy ones. I can testify to this firsthand from playing almost full Accuracy for years now, as stated in my original comment.

Then again, I still miss with 400b+ worth of accuracy accessories, vs evasion (beginner) players whose entire gear is worth less than 700b. #balanced. So it's not really a question of "lowered damage" - especially since you can literally 1 combo most DR players with most classes after a CC (with ~261 AP vs 420+ DR), while you can just scoff and run away from an evasion one if you aren't playing one of the accuracies boosted classes. Best part, the evasion player deals back full damage to you hitting you 100% of the time (even though they have less accuracy due to gloves and crystals) ... cus that seems balanced to PA and some of the BDO community. #logic.

NW/Siege are 90% capped, so evasion is a non-factor there most of the time. If we were building for the avg, then a 700b accuracy or dr set would deal the same damage to Evasion as evasion does to it. Or it would deal less damage (cus eva = tankiness build), but eva would deal {way} less damage back towards the accuracy/dr build. Instead, full eva on several classes deals full damage to everyone, while not receiving any damage themselves. THIS IS NOT AT ENDGAME, in fact, it's even worse for non-top-spec players and creates major frustrations in this game.

In fact, I had a whole guild from Aion migrate to BDO a couple of years ago excited to do PvP and most of them quit the game specifically due to the Evasion problem - it being almost impossible {or insanely expensive} to counter or immensely boring (because its OP) to play. These were players who like fun and competition in pvp, not just winning mindlessly.

Cool story bro. Good on you.

You can not gain a 100% hit rate with full accuracy, something you should know if you have explored this topic extensively. The max accuracy you can reach is about 1200-1250 (for only 1.2T in total gear) while the max evasion (with the same AP) you can reach is about 1350-1400 (for 1T in gear). That is a 90% hit rate, not counting eva % modifiers on some classes, addons, skill buffs etc. That is 200b left extra on the evasion build to push for more AP (eg. Debo Neck/Belt), or 200b left to just save yourself 20+ hrs of grinding for whatever you want to do next.

Furthermore, A 261AP (not 280!) full evasion player on a meta class (that has abhorrent accuracy/damage modifiers) can kill a 740gs DR/Accuracy player quite easily. Dunno where you get your info that it isn't so, there are countless videos on the topic and you could just go into the battle arena and see this for yourself. On the other hand, a 740gs player {not wearing any accuracy and not being an accuracy-meta-class} might not DO ANY DAMAGE whatsoever to a 680-700gs evasion player. Seems legit.

Heck, try succession sorc, you will not do any damage to even non-evasion players because the main 2 dps skills the class has, have 0% accuracy on them. Evasion is so FUN to play against - much skill, much wow, just like cc resistances - who doesn't love some RNG in their "skill-based" pvp?

Well, I guess if it happens only rarely to YOU {have you been in RBF in the past year? - its all evasion apes}, then it's not something thats pertinent - even though it makes you scratch your head.

Yup, it's only the players that have realized (the truth) that accuracy and DR are completely dead and forsaken in this game, and the meta is going Evasion on a class with copious Accuracy buffs and Accuracy-To-Hit-On-Skills. Or the randos that happen to play an evasion class and spec like that anyway because that's what the gearing guide says.

What can I say more to hammer this point than the fact that you, A Valk, a quintessentially DR class have come to this same conclusion and have swapped to evasion (since its better for pvp regardless of whether you have the modifiers and base stats or not). In reality, Evasion is the counter to Evasion, not accuracy. Since with accuracy, you will be receiving 100% damage, while potentially dishing out 30-50% more of your own than usual. In comparison to that, with evasion, you gain 30-70% more tankiness which is way more valuable in pvp, while dealing 100% damage to all the DR/Accuracy builds.

The fact of the matter is that in open-world PvP or in RBF - the two places where gear matters, evasion is king, since it's WAY WAY WAY cheaper to hit a threshold of immortality (while dealing 100% damage yourself) then hitting the same threshold in tankiness with DR, or precision with Accuracy. This is compounded by the fact that you can even be playing a WAY MORE EXPENSIVE accuracy build and still miss a ton if you're vs an evasion-stat-stacked class with a non-accuracy-meta class.

Man thats is a massive wall of text, at work atm will take a look at it later and try to respond.

Out of curiosity were do you fall on your GS reason I ask will help me respond better to you.

You obviously in previous statement hit some pen accuracy gear but I get the feeling that the rest of your gear is lacking.

If your not dual Pen blackstars (c19main and dandi)and a c14-19 nouver or pen BS offhand and full PEN accessories you should of never touched a accuracy accessory those accessories won't do a thing for you. You are missing ~50 to 62 accuracy alone if your at Tet bs and or no caphras. There are so many things you can do without ever touching a turos belt. Considering the avg accuracy gain of a full set of accuracy is like 30 accuracy over a accuracy offhand.

At my gear score without accuracy accessories just putting on a c14 accuracy offhand pretty much kills most evasion builds. Outside of certain classes and 1500 evasion but anything under that may require 2 to 3 combo's but that is normal.

Idk most problems get solved with a accuracy offhand if not generally I call it a  meme and move on unless multiple are hitting them.

I get the feeling you guys don't like the truth and all you want is to sit in your own little echo chamber of complaints. 

Just a FYI if you are not c19 on main hand and awakening with at least c14 on offhand you should in NOWAY shape or Form be messing with any accuracy accessories. 

If you are not the above minimum this conversation about accuracy vs evasion you have ZERO buisness discussing you have zero credibility or knowledge of what it is like or what to do against a evasion meme. Let alone someone with 1200-1300 evasion anything less than the above will not give you the Damage to bypass the DR ON a c20/tri Fallen god let alone the accuracy needed.

50 accuracy is alot to lose and simply tossing on tet dawns or turos/lunar may alow you to hit better. But your AP will be well below what is needed to do damage.