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UTC 3 : 23 29. Apr 2024
CEST 5 : 23 29. Apr 2024
PDT 20 : 23 28. Apr 2024
EDT 23 : 23 28. Apr 2024
DP should not be a nearly useless stat in pvp.
22. Okt 2022, 00:22 (UTC)
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Zeitpunkt der letzten Änderungen : 23. Okt 2022, 08:22 (UTC)
# 11

If a 522DP (1400 Eva, 400dr) Shai can't survive then kekw what hope do any of you think there is for you? I swear, gearless know nothing and they assume everything. 

Zeitpunkt der letzten Änderungen : 23. Okt 2022, 08:27 (UTC)
# 12
On: Oct 23, 2022, 07:37 (UTC), Written by HouseOfTalenvard

I'm a 400 DP Valkyrie, which is supposed to be a tank-style class, and yet I get 1-2 shot, especially in RBF, and especially against Ranger.

400 isnt even a bracket get one more asap :)

...and then do a proper endgame build with cadry and see how much picture changes.

Zeitpunkt der letzten Änderungen : 23. Okt 2022, 12:14 (UTC)
# 13

Everyone's a high damage protected class with burst, there's no sliding scale:

In most games, each type of class brings their own unique value to the table. 

Ranged classes should be dealing faster, lower damage from range to account for being able to attack from a safer distance, but depending on what melee class that ranged class is fighting, range doesn't really matter because certain classes gap closing ability means staying at a safe distance isn't really an option. Take musa or berserker for example. They can stay at range and reset a fight better than most ranged classes. 

Faster classes should be dealing lower damage numbers at higher speed because they most benefit from comboing, finding gaps, acting on reaction, triggering skill add ons or positive innate effects from skills like heal on use, and other things fast classes can do that slower classes can't

Slower classes dealing more significant damage with some way to protect themselves and stay in a fight for the speed at which they attack. 

If you pit one person with slow damage and decent multipliers against someone who can put five or six skills with decent mulitpliers on CD in the same time, that fight is already decided, and that's before taking into account class vs class damage modifiers, or one class having a better passive or excellent sustain, access to powerful heals, whether they have escape skills, good buff skills or scaling especially well with DP/Evasion in comparison to their opponent.

Infinite sprints, infinite iframes and perma protections need to go, gaps are supposed to be there and matchups for a lot of classes are quite balanced if the damage across the board was overall reduced. The most popular pvp modes these days seem to be the set gear/capped modes because people can enjoy the fight for longer.

The problem if you reduce all damage for all classes, is that there will be some classes who flourish thanks to staying alive longer and have the utility and the kits to compensate, while there will be a few classes whose only way of staying alive is dealing as much damage as possible to end a fight quickly because their kits or design lack the utility to achieve anything else. 

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Zeitpunkt der letzten Änderungen : 23. Okt 2022, 12:41 (UTC)
# 14
On: Oct 23, 2022, 07:35 (UTC), Written by Saeii

Well if you're agreeing that double Cadry valk build is working then it means DP isn't a useless stat. I'm not saying it shouldn't work. I'm only pointing out it exists and people are running that build because it works well

Yeah I should have clarified...it absolutely does not work, at least at the level youd expect considering the gear investment at that upper end (who cares about investing into more DP when the difference is almost unnoticable at that level anyway?). And this is besides the point, the point is at relatively equal levels of gear, the 1 shot, 1 CC and dead meta is uninteresting (and ill even say as a grab class, is kind of cheesy).

Zeitpunkt der letzten Änderungen : 23. Okt 2022, 12:44 (UTC)
# 15
On: Oct 23, 2022, 12:12 (UTC), Written by Rux

Everyone's a high damage protected class with burst, there's no sliding scale:

In most games, each type of class brings their own unique value to the table. 

Ranged classes should be dealing faster, lower damage from range to account for being able to attack from a safer distance, but depending on what melee class that ranged class is fighting, range doesn't really matter because certain classes gap closing ability means staying at a safe distance isn't really an option. Take musa or berserker for example. They can stay at range and reset a fight better than most ranged classes. 

Faster classes should be dealing lower damage numbers at higher speed because they most benefit from comboing, finding gaps, acting on reaction, triggering skill add ons or positive innate effects from skills like heal on use, and other things fast classes can do that slower classes can't

Slower classes dealing more significant damage with some way to protect themselves and stay in a fight for the speed at which they attack. 

If you pit one person with slow damage and decent multipliers against someone who can put five or six skills with decent mulitpliers on CD in the same time, that fight is already decided, and that's before taking into account class vs class damage modifiers, or one class having a better passive or excellent sustain, access to powerful heals, whether they have escape skills, good buff skills or scaling especially well with DP/Evasion in comparison to their opponent.

Infinite sprints, infinite iframes and perma protections need to go, gaps are supposed to be there and matchups for a lot of classes are quite balanced if the damage across the board was overall reduced. The most popular pvp modes these days seem to be the set gear/capped modes because people can enjoy the fight for longer.

The problem if you reduce all damage for all classes, is that there will be some classes who flourish thanks to staying alive longer and have the utility and the kits to compensate, while there will be a few classes whose only way of staying alive is dealing as much damage as possible to end a fight quickly because their kits or design lack the utility to achieve anything else. 

"The problem if you reduce all damage for all classes, is that there will be some classes who flourish thanks to staying alive longer and have the utility and the kits to compensate, while there will be a few classes whose only way of staying alive is dealing as much damage as possible to end a fight quickly because their kits or design lack the utility to achieve anything else."

In fairness I think this is a good point. It would certainly have to be a consideration in the wider scheme of things (class balance itself should already be a priority of PA anyway) but I still think at the end of the day, the scaling of AP/Damage to Defense ratio is just fundamentally way off at the higher end.

Zeitpunkt der letzten Änderungen : 23. Okt 2022, 13:04 (UTC)
# 16

Sure, let's make endgear players immortals, so less geared players can never win vs them even with much better pvp abilities.

Zeitpunkt der letzten Änderungen : 23. Okt 2022, 13:16 (UTC)
# 17
Écrit le : 23 oct. 2022, 12:44 (UTC), par : Dimitreus

class balance itself should already be a priority of PA anyway

Unfortunately, they can't balance a game with so much classes, with new ones always waiting at the corner, which are their strongest monetization lever.

Zeitpunkt der letzten Änderungen : 23. Okt 2022, 13:40 (UTC)
# 18
On: Oct 23, 2022, 13:04 (UTC), Written by Dijkstran

Sure, let's make endgear players immortals, so less geared players can never win vs them even with much better pvp abilities.

#1. If the disparity is great enough, youre getting grabbed and half comboed anyway.

#2. We're talking about bringing the TTK down a *little* bit between relatively equally geared players. Its not an all or nothing thing. 

Zeitpunkt der letzten Änderungen : 23. Okt 2022, 16:08 (UTC)
# 19

what they SHOULD do is make all grabs apply freeze like "buff" to people and give them 80%+ DR but make all grab ccs last longer, as some sorf of removal from fight for 5+ seconds (see novas special freeze skill), not literal death sentence 1 button execution as it is now the second msot classes get grabbed sans few.

Zeitpunkt der letzten Änderungen : 23. Okt 2022, 17:25 (UTC)
# 20

If we're brainstorming, you could have blocks counter grabs on reaction and create some kind of punishment for the grabber.

- Block counters grabs

- Grabs counter super armour

- Block break counters blocks

Additionally you could spread the value of blocks and grabs between the classes by ensuring:

- Everyone who has a grab, shouldn't have a block

- Everyone who has a block, shouldn't have a grab

- If you don't have a block or a grab, you have the better block break and block prevention

- if you have block and grab, that probably needs to be looked at somehow to sacrifice something else in exchange. 

- No 360 degree SA blocks

- Not having multiple grabs

- Not having extended grabs 

- No ranged grabs

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