TLDR;

Add a solo area for flame and ember progression

Added to Opening post (15th Oct)

( So easy to fix this :) PA, add flame drop to Thornwood.. Sorted, Then the Side drops make up for not getting stuff )

Extended rant;

A key progression element is locked behind a 2 group Grind With no other options of progression in that area. Key progression being, once you hit a point, the step MUST be taken in order to progress, E.G getting a flame for the quest.

Puzzles me sometimes how long some people spend going in circles… I get why people do it, they can feel like they are progressing without having to think. A game where you play it while doing something else, weird, but this is the generation of participation rosettes and that is the main target audience of PA.

That aside, I have to make the choice; do I force me self to mindless grind in circles at Torus (and it’s not your best work PA, no one wants to be there), one of the most dull location in BDO (I guess that’s why you put a key item there, artificial retention), do I hope I get a 1 out of 4000 chance of getting a flame on the marker (Actual odds are not that good as more people will cue to a randome chance, so its unknown) , or do I call it a day and forget fallen god?

Well, I just can’t do it, Its not fun game play, so I will play with what I have. Which is a shame, I would love to progress my gear as I PVP, but to do that, the only option is a single function PVE , reparative, zero content (entertainment wise) task. This is a failure of game design and you know it.

The fact I have now put in a total of 6 hours on and off, and have one ember (yeah, not much time in total, but not much progression eithere, not good game play and PA knows this, I play game for fun), you cant expect me to play that. Lol (and now comes the advice from people that don’t get my point, no tips please, that’s not the issues, I’m not you, I don’t like that mindless grind, I’m only managing the 6 hours because I have knowledge to gain there)

The FIX;

Make it worth people while to farm and sell flames. You thought you had solved this issue by increasing caphra drops in the area, You failed and you know it.

The only way you will encourage people to farm or even sell a flame is to make it worth while. We are talking 3-5 billion cap on market place. Sure it will lock some people out, you don’t have that cash, maybe they can go grind :P But it adjust the opportunity to the players that need it and have the abilities to obtain the needed cash (via grinding, Enhancing, Gathering, Farming.. all the game soption, not just one mindless dull , trash game repeat, you failed here and you know it), Proving progression for them that need it the most (this is called good game design, give it a try)

Or, offer an ember daily quest that is not main numbingly dull (you can get a pen acessory with many option for doing so, a PEN Accessory! easy to buy! But the flame? You have failed here and you know it). One ember, that means you can get your flame in 100 days, I would rather than grind the dullness of torus… I would rather know that in a 100 days I have the flame than grind day after day, not sure when the nightmare will be over (Hay PA, tell you what, I will grind for the flame if; I record all my grind and you watch them all, Yes, I want a video of you watching me grind till I get the flame, sound fun? Deal? You already dodge the first 6 hours).

Why is this important? It’s a key item, It’s a very strange bottle neck to progression, and the method only suites as portion of the player base, with no other options (that is bad game design and you know it, swallow your pride and fix it – what if the PEN accessory could only be obtained by horse training or sailing? There would be uproar, well this is the same issue and you know it)

And that you can only obtain this items at a 2 group location, that is bad game design. I don’t group apart form PvP, when time is set aside for node wars in the evening. When I grind, because I hate it so much, I may to 30 mins and have a chill, I may do 10 mins and chill, healthy games play, you not a fan of that PA? you think people should sit and grind for hours on end? (so the loot scroll changes where just what people like me needed, you know long play session are not for everyone, you know this and have acknowledged it publicly)

Why lock it behind at 2 party group system that punished people that rarely group, for a Key progression item? You don’t even do this for treasure, The map? The potion? The merchant ring (kind of). You have added this strange requirement to this area of progression and it should not be this way (this is bad game design and you know it), a solo option should be available at minimum…

Anyways, I’m not Streamer or big name (but am know in game :P on the PVP scene) so PA and forum staff will ignore this post, that just life :P

Have to wonder if PA just want some people that hate torus to whale? Seems like it, by putting a key component behind this gate. PA, that's a scam and you know it :P

?1

BLACK DESERT ONLINE is a korean grinder MMO.

Please refrain from telling them to stop being what they were intentionally made to be. What they were originally meant to be.

It like asking them to change the entire game model on the fly. It cannot and will not be done. 

</////>

Brown nosing much?
Actually, given their culture and based on what 'Choice' (NA BDO partner/streamer) Said when he visited their offices and was told information. They are not fans of group content and are more geared toward solo play (Have no reason to believe ‘Choice’ lied)... This is why it took so long to see more group areas and group activates added to the game, but this was done for the international market.

So it would seem you have no idea what you are talking about but assumed to know.

Stop telling me what not to be telling them, if they have an issue with what I said, they can tell me... why do they need you to do it for them... oh wait because they rarely read this stuff, the forum are a placatory method that makes people think PA are listning (Only redits with mega up votes and drama get PA’s attention), all we are doing it talking among ourselves and shouting into the wind

Additon:

Originally BDO was to have No pity system.. That change. They originally wanted items in game that not everyone could get (in a video somewhere).

When I played Korean MMOS of old, they seem to contain a lot more potential disappointment, but this did do well in the west.

Example, 1990s, A game not too different to BDO in content; if you died you dropped items, if you where Pked, you dropped items (so people would randomly kill you for stuff)

If your item reached zero durability, it would be destroyed, so you had to keep an eye on it. Once you repaired that item, it’s max durability would be reduced, no matter how rare the item, it was not going to last… so you may have a rare ring drop, knowing it’s going to be gone in time.

If you died you didn’t just lose EXP but you could de level. People could resurect you and kill you over and over and the where allowed too.

Skill had to be unlocked and level over months and years, no catch up systems, not short cuts, not pay to win, just a monthly sub. To unlock such skills, not only did you need the level, you then had to have the book drop (and some skills where very rare) and then level up the skill.. Some people went without skills their counterparts had, just the way it was.

Korean MMos I know of where harsh… too hard for the west, BDO only retains some of these element, such as crystal braking on death.. But they have already given in on their pity system, so who knows.

Good thing they didn’t stick to their Korean roots, else BDO would not be half as fun as it is.. and it’s life span in this day and age (and current target audience), BDO would be over

Did a test, pushed my self to do an hour solo at turos.. clear speed was not that bad, little bit slower than a 2 man group next to me.

I got zero embers, I got 6 caphras and 2k trash.. Why? Well it’s a group spot Duh! You see, the side rewards are pitiful, if only there was a solo area as well, hmm. And there are many reaons people don’t group play.. some really don’t want too, some play the game in short burst and a group is not appropriate (<this is normally me, PA are aware of this issue and addressed loot scrolls in response -only) and some people just cant find a group that wants them (so get of your high horse when you think people just need to group, we are not all the same, that's your failings and immaturity that leads you to think that <that is directed at some players, not PA, I know PA know of this issue, just don’t get why they haven’t address it here, as they have in other areas…oversight? Not a priority?).

All recoded, may do the test again, see if I can get another hour in with no embers. That's now a total of hours 8 and 2 embers, does that work out at 400h of turos for the solo player? Wow, PA, this is where players drop out of the game (I think the video will be titled ‘The solo player; this is why your quit’)… I wont stop playing, love the game, but some people around here hate to hear when BDO/PA is pulled up on a mistake in game… BDO is great, its not perfect, don’t get your knickers in a twist (yeah you down voter :P Upset at my post) when an issue is pointed out, this is how we make the game better

It was hour spent in a game not being entertained, not feeling progression of any kind (because the side items I made would be 10 fold at a solo spot)… This is bad game design and PA knows this. If a player spends 1h playing your game actively, they should see progression, this is a standard, PA have created a bottle neck that fails this standard (this is game dev stuff)

To the steamer that don’t feel this way, put your self in the solo person shoes, turn off you stream interaction and grind out a flame solo, offline see how you feel

To the guides that hunt together, maybe take some time out by your self and give it a shot.

Yeah it’s working for you, so you don’t see an issue or even care.. But you should.. We want a better game but we are not all the same.

This post won’t be read by anyone relevant to PA. First they have to look (we don’t know that they do) Then the person looking has to care about the issue in order for it to get past on… Better chance of hitting a pen on a zero stack :P

I started out on the forum being polite, but I soon learned it’s a placation chamber where we waste out time pretending what we type means anything … now I’m bitter and twisted :P

Addition;

And even if PA did not add a solo area.. The fix to bring the task up to standard isn’t hard. Form level 61 you can take a daily, kill 500 torus and get an ember… so if you don’t even get a drop, you have progressed… This is not university level stuff, how can you be failing it so badly? Different standard at PA? Stretch out content and hope people will put up with it? Ah … nail on the head :)

That may be too ez, but I would not complain :P

Rather is was more organic and a player / group that didn’t mind grinding that area felt the worth of getting flames, e.g upping the market place cap all the way to 6bill and letting the market decide.

I would rather grind 6bill in silver / sell enhancements that solo grind that place. My current option of waiting for a pre order, which their are 4k waiting (RNG chance) and only 5k transaction ever made, or grinding the silver for the armor it self, making my PEN tree and c10 redundant (that I made my self, as that was my path of progression – but it from seasonal tet, so I can’t sell it, strange that PA put that path in there, then this bottle neck, almost seems to be a mistake on their part :P)

A mix of improvement would be good, A solo area, also make it more worth to grind a flame for people that have already done it and have access to a group.

Things have moved fast in BDO and Fallen god will become (if not already) the new minimum standard of any serious NW / siege guilds, and I don’t mean the top tiers (they are even more needy, they want garmoth hearts on your tarina axes)

Added. and that comment  'As for the Turo spot, stop being anti social and party up, there is always someone looking to do Turos.' shows how immature you are. Narrow minded. (this had to be aded after my post, as they added the snide comment after if gave it a like for beeing funny..  they got nasty.. some people :P guess the one like ravved them up *1)

You want to group with me? I take brakes often, like every 15-30min for 5-10 mins (for reasons that are not of you business), you gonna group with me for a few hours and wait, common step up and put your money where your mouth is... I’m up for it....

This is a huge issue when it comes to debate ideas with narrow minded people like your else. People will agree with you and not think, 'why is this person not in a group', When you get older, maybe widen your social group a bit, you will learn we are not all the same, and it has very little to do with being anti social. eh, at least you have shown what you are :)

*1)

as you can see, completely ignore what was posted, and just decided to attack... they arnt taking part in the conversation, they are just here to Toll. IF it continues, I guess it needs reporting. Read what has been posted before engaging or don’t post EZ. This is not the first one of my post they have done this on (not read the post, yet posted an attack), and it’s starting to look like they are stalking me

Was it too hard to stop at "Add a solo area for flame and ember progression"?

While the suggestion in itself is not necessarily bad (though I personally think it is not bad to create some needs for groups from time to time), the tone you're using is way too aggressive and the reasons you're using are way too personal.

You grind for 30 minutes then take a break for 10 minutes? No problem! But should devs bury the idea of making group spots and promote them with these drops because of this? If that's how you play, you deal with the consequences. What's amazing is that you called Franklins immature and narrow-minded, talk about irony. 

As you said, things can change. BDO allowed solo play for a long time, now they added some group spots, and even incentive to go there. And it's not like you need a optimized and buffed full team of experienced players to go there. 

I knew someone would bring that up :) yeah, it would be reasonable to stop there and be nice, that’s how I started out on the forum. Then I learned what they where and meh, why not be a little assy. not like this it read by staff, nor really matters

re; 'What's amazing is that you called Franklins immature and narrow-minded, talk about irony. ' and you point is? so we can’t both be immature?

You see, when I post nice little thread (really put some effort in, even edit up a video, take onboard the suggestion of the CM on submitting such things), there is no engagement, add a little spice, upset the bizzy bodies a little and you get traction, ty for playing your part :)

Re ‘…reasons you're using are way too personal. You grind for 30 minutes then take a break for 10 minutes?’
If people could put two and two together (unlike yourself... dont get angery at me becuse you cant work stuff out), you would see why I point out that ‘PA know this already’ The need for brakes and none long grinds is not just a personal issue, it’s a current focus issues with PA (maybe watch more of their reports?). It was stated by PA that it was wrong of them to expect people to grind for 30mins or more (you see, before I open my mouth, I do my research, and talk about reality, not what I have invented in my head or belived to be true from an echo chamber –to aggressive? Here is a reason for that, you are talking trash and without facts).

what is very wrong here is, i have to deal with you lot inventing things and postening them here. I can show they are invented, but it still comes, very harassing (as peole start to gange up on me).. almost enough to make someone agressive on the forums.. hmm.. could you be the part of the problem? This is called gaslighting. you know what your doing :P

PA themselves have already taken onboard this issues accepted fault (in a videos and the loot scrools where part of the solution) but have not addressed it in all areas. And now that I have pointed that out to you, you will get your knickers in a twist :)

Where as, if you are mature enough yourself, you will accept you just made a mistake because you where ill informed and assumed this was my personal (only mine) issue

But in your life, this isn’t an issue you or your friends have, so it docent exits. It’s always the ones with the smallest scope, the narrowest of view that like to come to my post for a dig, and each time, I can show them up and they get upset.

So far I have had people post on here and make claims that are with wrong or have no foundation (another reason I get agitated and now post in the manner I do, your sort create the hate with your made up facts, and people like me, we walk away and leave you to your echo chambers).

You are wrong because; you are in direct contradiction to what PA has actuality said. It can’t be more simple than that. Making what you said (apart from your comments on my aggression) fabricated and valueless, you have invented a fairytail.

Next bully?

ADDITION:

Because I know none of the people posting so far acutely listen to what PA says, you do realize even the new group dungeons they stated that they were working on a solo method to complete them… yeah SOLO. This is a goal of PA, stated by them and something they want to achieve.
They have great concern about the solo player.. Wait didn’t I already explain this, yes I did, up a few posts, when someone made false claims about BDO..

so to anyone of reason, who can look pass the sass, you will see, although im a bit rude (reason explaind) im not wrong, but each person that has come to counter me, or put me down... they have been proven to be in the wrong... they ahve addded nothing :P the invetors of fact, pretended of information are the sort tht damge games. They have no real understanding but pretend to and gange up on posters they disagree with... i mean, what wrong with a solo option? Its the sort of stuff PA want too, just they have missed this part out :)

Not one has said, oh, ‘I see your point’, or ‘oh I didn’t know that the direction PA was taking’, you know, the mature thing to do and then we talk.. no, they attack the post and when proven wrong, crawl back under a rock and wait for the next person to pounce on (forum bullies, get them everywhere), That is toxic, but they hide is so well :P

I'm not wrong at all, the points I mentioned can be checked very easily :

- your tone is aggressive. Your tone. TONE ("swallow your pride and fix it"? Serious?) 

- you're using personal reasons to make a point. 30 min grind for 10 minutes break? Yes, and? Does it matter in the current situation? That's how it is, so Franklins' answer is right on point. 

- You want solo play? Yes, and some would like to see more group content, they got it quite recently. Time to be open-minded, buddy. 

Long post and colors won't make you right. My precise points remain, but did you read them anyway? 

Too bad, there was some interesting points in your topic but you ruined it yourself by being "assy". Now I wonder how you can deal with the next "bully" when you can't deal with the first ones. But we may also let you self-destruct your own topic. 

Extra post becuse this is going of somewhere strange, and im constantly having to defend my personal point, or PA anouments... while the forum bullies try to derail and belittle me.

You seen, even when I’m right, its may fault because I didn’t type nice (so if you have a valid point, still doesn’t matter, you also have to satisfy their standard of communication, fair? Nah, but its there method to dismiss you no mater that you do, to bully you and lay there mistake at your feet)

I still think the forums have no purpose, and it’s down to people like we have seen. If I can point them out and make other feel a little safer to post, at laest that is something. No wonder the forums are ignored, just look at us :P on all sides, no one want to read this trash

I would ask we stay on topic, less of the attacking my presitation, more to the topic. Its not that i cant take you down a peg as i have over and over... its just you are derailing im point (and i know thats your point)

If I’m to show PA respect when addressing them indirectly (re my opening post), they can also show me the respect of acknowledgment It goes both ways, yes they have a great game, but it dosen mean they can make a fake*1 suggestions and feedback section and waste people time, not even acknowledging that someone read a post. Lets not forget, i pay thier wages :P

Treat people like trash, and they will treat you the same, sure PA can close me down, be a silly given I have spend 1’000s on their game, and I may not look to kindly to having my forum about closed by some mod (you bet I will take issues with that, i have a good understanding of the law)

1*) the opening of this sections is an invitation to give feedback, a request, that is then ignored (not even a icon to say read by mod). If I asked you for your advice, you gave it and I didn’t even acknowledge you where there, you would be upset too. If you don’t want feedback don’t pretend you do.

dont blame me for beeing upset you our the one upseting me.. E.g. 'Stop hitting your slef'