Giving people incentive to party up will cure a lot of griefing.

Red players do have a place, as it creates new risks other than mindless monsters.

Destroying the open world mechanics will destroy BDO.  All that is needed is giving players more incentive to work together rather than against each other.  The competitiveness that has been the core of this game ultimately spawns toxic behavior.  All that needs to be done is to give us reasons to work together.

Also, if there were more parties roaming about, it makes PKing less of a threat, and gives red players the interesting option of teaming together themselves.

BDO does not need to change much.  All the devs need to do is work a couple tiny, intelligent tweaks to work wonders for this game, not this mass-mutation that they're trying to orchestrate.

PA, as Finn the Human said, "The road you're on leads to nowhere."

New players are already protected as it is with Season Servers. There's also Marni Realm. I get that there needs to be repercussions for Pk'ing. But don't make it to where it's detrimental to PvP as a whole. I think they should rethink the whole Karma system and GvG system. Maybe implement something new in their place. Make PvP fun and worthwhile. While still not infringing on those who don't like PvP. The Karma system and GvG doesn't really work anymore for what they're trying to do. They're changing it to be more PvE friendly (which I get, there are people who HATE PvP) but by doing so they're continually choking the PvPers in the process. They lump the Pk'ers in with all the other PvPers out there (technically Pk is PvP as it stands for Player Versus Player). It's just typically an unfair advantage (war isn't supposed to be fair). But there are PvPers that like the fight to be fair and there are people who PvP as a way to defend their spot. But there needs to be incentive other than "I want your grindspot."

So the devs really need to ask the question, "what kind of PvP do we want this game to have?" The way it is now is just a mess. They're against 'forced pvp' (as they've repeatedly shown with the continual addition of negative karma penalties) yet, they still have it as an option. Maybe have a bounty system. The higher your negative karma (which you'd still get for killing lower-geared players than you) the higher the bounty. As a different and more challanging way of punishing red players. While making it fun and engaging for both sides. But then you'd have to give people a different reason to go red. A good reason. Real incentive. Otherwise it's the same as it is now (fighting over grindspots, or pking out of boredom). So, that's another question they'd have to ask, "what is going to be the incentive for flagging?" Or they could remove the Karma and GvG systems completely by adding a faction system instead that you can join. Not like 'War of the Roses'. But open-world. I have a post on this topic. So I won't go into too much detail on it here. Basically you can only PvP with players on the opposing factions. Leaving the PvE players (provided their guild doesn't join a faction) alone.

Regardless, they need to rework and rethink the whole 'karma' system. Have a system that's equitable to both parties (PvE and PvP). No system is completely flawless however.

real.....

This dislike comes from somewhere, you know? The things you mentioned, like a red waiting for the grind to finish and duel after, I never ever seen that; my experience with reds are: killing me to drop my buffs, then swapping channel when I get up, not even taking my spot; trying to feed my crystals to mobs (back when this was possible); killing my alts at world boss/field boss train; attacking us while doing guild boss; killing me/knocking me off horse while afk riding; attacking me on the road Heidel while traveling (placing traps on the road, shooting with nodewar matchlock from the cliff at Heidel pass); killing me while tending to my garden on my farming skill alt; killing me while gathering for no reason (they did not take my spot); killing me while fishing (not too many times, I learned quickly to fish in safe zones).

Yes, I'm biased, because all I have ever got from reds is griefing. I have never ever saw an example for red players being a positive factor in this game. Thus, I advocate for them being gone.

Had some "fun" being farmed on my matchlock alt at Rawr-Rawr, so ye, fk red karma players, the sooner they are gone the better. (And thats how they create bias against themselves and open world PVP, good job again.)

idk bro all these issues are avoidable and do not substantiate an argument for destroying all red player s

Not all spots have marni realms.

World/Field bosses are no big deal.. maybe for you; it is a big deal for others.

What if the guild is not that strong combined as the attackers, for example, a new guild with new players?
You can't travel with magnus to every single node in tha game, so you have to travel at least some with horse.
Lvl 49 characters are very limited in all aspects. Also, how the hell do I use a lvl49 character to travel with my other characters? Why should I limit myself because of players who are using the flaws of the system to grief me?
All you counter-arguments are bad or outright ridiculous.

If we are at it, why do red players have to do all these? Why can't they do proper PVP? Like, when the other player is aware of the attack and can fight back?
All these things I listed, DO substantiate destroying red players, because they use the system for griefing and harrassment, not proper PVP content.

Skill issue

Because it's a playstyle that places an intentionally extreme limitation on the players that do so, which they find fun. It's something that is explicitly allowed in the game, and I think it should stay that way, because the people who would be "victims" of it have multiple tools to avoid it. You aren't losing literal hours of progress by dying at a field boss, you're being inconvenienced by 30-50 seconds at most.

Maybe if the pvp content that was offered in the game were actually rewarding & worthwhile they would do that, but the developers aren't doing anything to meaningfully fix that problem, nor are they adjusting the open world system to give players ways to play together *like the post I made suggests.* 

The spots that don't have marni realms are either Group spots or Endgame spots. If the suggestions I made in the vein of allowing actual party play were implemented, we wouldn't have nearly as big an issue with this. Most red players aren't trying to 1v5.

In the situations where I suggest you use them, not at all; you don't need high character levels to Fish, Gather, Train or Farm. The only lifeskill you can't really do this on is Hunting, but Hunting rotations are very very large so it's unlikely you will be unable to swap to another server & find no open rotations.

Summing all of this up, the solution is not "just kneecap all red players," that is a very narrow-minded approach & view of the situation. The whole point of the initial post is to approach this from multiple angles; Solicited PVP & PVE Content, Balancing the Karma system more, Making the open world be more meaningful. I'm ok with solutions like making field bosses no-pvp zones like world bosses, by the way. I think that's fine.

I have to ask, on what server this behavior takes place?

I am almost always on Calpheon 3: two years ago, I'd be Pk'd once a month (while minding my own business, not grinding).  Now I haven't had it happen for more than a year.... and I do all sorts of things, World Bosses, fishing, farming, gathering........... Seldom a soul to be seen, much less a red player.

Seen quite a few reds on Arsha, though.......

So... a case example: There are those guys who run around Yzrahid, backstabbing people who are grinding, not wanting any meaningful fight or experience, just making their victims lose buffs and running away - griefing. How does your system work against those people?

Because I perceive this as a problem for the game per se. They are simply trying to make the game difficult to play and annoy other players to the point of leaving. Why should I play something where this is allowed - other players actively blocking me from playing? Is this desirable for the health of the game? I prefer ruining red players' experience than the experience of everyone else...