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UTC 11 : 6 May 15, 2024
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#Suggestions
Making PvP more accessible: 3 step suggestions
Apr 15, 2021, 22:08 (UTC)
2745 23
1 2 3
Last Edit : Apr 15, 2021, 22:18 (UTC)
# 1

perceived problem that I'd like to address:

 

Too many players, especially newer players, have trouble getting into BDO PvP. BDO PvP, despite many flaws and many valid criticisms, is very enjoyable and I think that when players become engaged in the PvP scene, they play the game more and become more immersed in the community. We want more players to enter the PvP scene and feel confident about doing so, because I believe those players who do will find more connection with the game, bring more friends into the game, and stick around longer, too.  

  

Step 1: expand T1 Nodewar caps to additional areas of PvP, and apply them consistently. 

 

Gear is an important part of BDO, for better or worse. It's good to upgrade gear and become stronger. At the same time, large gear disparity can feel very bad for newer players. 

 

I propose: First, enable the T1 Nodewar stat caps (240AP 300DP, applied automatically regardless of what gear you are wearing) in Red Battlefield Castle Ruins 1. Leave the rest at normal, no-cap rules, but enable the T1 NW stat caps for one RBF, and let's see how popular that becomes. Currently, RBF is a fun place for siege guild members and not so fun for 90% of the playerbase. The majority of players know that they simply don't belong in RBF, and that is hardly fun, is it? So let 1 of the 10 RBF servers have T1 NW caps instated, so that far more players can enjoy it. 

 

Next, enable the T1 nodewar stat caps in Battle Arena 1, as well. Leave the rest of the battle arenas uncapped, but make 1 BA be capped. While many players in BA are happy to switch to a trial character or gear-match you for friendly sparring, it would be so convenient and welcoming if there was simply a capped arena for people to flood into and participate in without any concerns about gear differences. 

 

It's important that this is applied exactly as it is in a T1 nodewar - it cannot be an error message that forces a player with too high stats to remove gear before entering - you cannot make this inconvenient; it needs to be simple & automatic. 

 

Next, put out a clear message of exactly how the T1 nodewar stat cap actually works, in a place that is easy to reference. To this day people argue whether human damage breaks the cap, or if 300DP sheet is as good as it gets or if 300 hidden DR is as good as it gets, etc - Just make this one thing clear to everyone, new players could really use something concrete and transparent. 

 

Finally, set ALL T1 Nodewars to the same 240AP, 300DP cap, consistently. Right now T1 is divided between T1 easy, medium, hard. The reason I say this, is because simplicity is purity, and it's generally a good thing. Players can easily acquire capotia accessories and Narchillian / nesser / oasis / tuvala gear. There is no need to have multiple gear caps for different nodes - just make all of T1 the same so that newer players can jump in without worrying too much about which node is which cap. 

 

What does step 1 really achieve? why do I suggest these things for step 1? Basically, the T1 gear cap of 240AP/300DP is very attainable in today's BDO. It's a goal any new player can target, and achieve, as they learn the game. They can try it out at their leisure in the T1-capped RBF, the T1-capped BA, and in any T1 nodewar. The ease of entering these different environments will lure them in - a player who's unsure about if they're ready for nodewar will try venturing into a T1-capped RBF, maybe get a couple kills and think "hey I can actually do this! this isn't so bad, let's try to do a T1 nodewar." Having it be the SINGLE gear cap that matters (no separate T1 caps at varying levels), for multiple PVP modes (a T1 capped nodewar, RBF and BA), makes messaging easy as well. There is no complexity in getting the message out to new players - there is no "get this gear But well actually it's way more complex than this" -- it is just simple. New players can hit 240/300, the single number that is recommended, and then they can have fair (or as fair as is possible) PvP in several different modes, very accessibly and easily.  

 

This highly attainable goal will pump up new players and get them willing to buy-in and get started. Once they start having fun and doing this, they'll get really engaged with the game. The biggest concern I see are new players who do some quests, equp their narch + capotia set, DFS vs a 600+GS guy, lose in 1 hit, and they wonder what they even play the game for. Having a breadth of PvP options available to them as soon as they achieve 240/300 would be huge!   

  

Step 2: Increase PvP rewards

 

RedBattlefield rewards are very small. I wouldn't ask you to make them so good that people don't bother grinding in the actual world, but maybe improve the rewards at least so that even an RBF loss would pay for buff & consumable use and it's not an actual loss to participate. You currently do RBF because it is fun, if you have sufficient gear to compete. the rewards basically pay for your villa/church buff and a few giant draughts. In today's world of Elvia servers & high mastery lifeskilling, RBF ought to be at least as profitable as grinding abandoned iron mines...

 

Nodewar costs easily exceed the rewards except at the highesat of levels. Even for a player who only has 240/300 gear, participating in a 2 hour nodewar means they are giving up 2 hours of grind or lifeskilling, and the NW rewards are nowhere near as good as 2 hours of grinding, even at that gear level. Nodewars are not exactly spammable all day every day, so what is the harm in making the rewards just plain better? 

 

The idea behind increasing rewards is straightforward. I want more people excited about NW and RBF, I want to see more fresh faces step up and into the community. I want more guilds placing forts on nodes, and more players excited to show up for wars. When more players are enticed & lured into PvP, it is quite possible that they will find something they enjoy! A lot of players are nervous about starting PvP, or feel it just isn't worth it -- but cajole them enough, lure them in - and sometimes they are surprised to find how much fun it is! No one is as zealous as a convert, and I think I was leery of PvP when I started, too. I took some convincing. But now I am passionate. 

 

Step 3: propaganda campaign

 

After you make the changes in step 1 & 2, Pearl Abyss and the members of the Partner program gotta do their marketing magic. Make some good videos, a highlights/clips reel of players shouting into voice chat to DIVE DIVE DIVE KILL THAT FORT AHHH!!!, cool panning images of guild banners on city streets, an announcements page with a nice little guide - something!! to hype new players up and sell them on the idea that YOU TOO can participate in EPIC LARGESCALE PvP without grinding your soul away for 6+ months to gear up first. Show them all that Nodewar is COOL, and that with just the main story quest and a few hours of grind, you also can do it!! 

 

Remember this EVE video? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AdfFnTt2UT0 Yes check this out -- it's edited together community videos with real comms, some fancy orchestral music - and it's so hype, it really sells the idea that this game is something COOL, I mean just listen to how enthusiastic all these players are, how can it not hype you up? I barely ever played EVE myself (like 700 hours years and years and years ago) but watching this video sometimes still has me itching to reinstall and try it. 

 

We need some of the same sort of stuff for BDO, too.  

  

Go for it!

Last Edit : Apr 15, 2021, 23:18 (UTC)
# 2
On: Apr 15, 2021, 22:08 (UTC), Written by Veltas

perceived problem that I'd like to address:

 

Too many players, especially newer players, have trouble getting into BDO PvP. BDO PvP, despite many flaws and many valid criticisms, is very enjoyable and I think that when players become engaged in the PvP scene, they play the game more and become more immersed in the community. We want more players to enter the PvP scene and feel confident about doing so, because I believe those players who do will find more connection with the game, bring more friends into the game, and stick around longer, too.  

  

Step 1: expand T1 Nodewar caps to additional areas of PvP, and apply them consistently. 

 

Gear is an important part of BDO, for better or worse. It's good to upgrade gear and become stronger. At the same time, large gear disparity can feel very bad for newer players. 

 

I propose: First, enable the T1 Nodewar stat caps (240AP 300DP, applied automatically regardless of what gear you are wearing) in Red Battlefield Castle Ruins 1. Leave the rest at normal, no-cap rules, but enable the T1 NW stat caps for one RBF, and let's see how popular that becomes. Currently, RBF is a fun place for siege guild members and not so fun for 90% of the playerbase. The majority of players know that they simply don't belong in RBF, and that is hardly fun, is it? So let 1 of the 10 RBF servers have T1 NW caps instated, so that far more players can enjoy it. 

 

Next, enable the T1 nodewar stat caps in Battle Arena 1, as well. Leave the rest of the battle arenas uncapped, but make 1 BA be capped. While many players in BA are happy to switch to a trial character or gear-match you for friendly sparring, it would be so convenient and welcoming if there was simply a capped arena for people to flood into and participate in without any concerns about gear differences. 

 

It's important that this is applied exactly as it is in a T1 nodewar - it cannot be an error message that forces a player with too high stats to remove gear before entering - you cannot make this inconvenient; it needs to be simple & automatic. 

 

Next, put out a clear message of exactly how the T1 nodewar stat cap actually works, in a place that is easy to reference. To this day people argue whether human damage breaks the cap, or if 300DP sheet is as good as it gets or if 300 hidden DR is as good as it gets, etc - Just make this one thing clear to everyone, new players could really use something concrete and transparent. 

 

Finally, set ALL T1 Nodewars to the same 240AP, 300DP cap, consistently. Right now T1 is divided between T1 easy, medium, hard. The reason I say this, is because simplicity is purity, and it's generally a good thing. Players can easily acquire capotia accessories and Narchillian / nesser / oasis / tuvala gear. There is no need to have multiple gear caps for different nodes - just make all of T1 the same so that newer players can jump in without worrying too much about which node is which cap. 

 

What does step 1 really achieve? why do I suggest these things for step 1? Basically, the T1 gear cap of 240AP/300DP is very attainable in today's BDO. It's a goal any new player can target, and achieve, as they learn the game. They can try it out at their leisure in the T1-capped RBF, the T1-capped BA, and in any T1 nodewar. The ease of entering these different environments will lure them in - a player who's unsure about if they're ready for nodewar will try venturing into a T1-capped RBF, maybe get a couple kills and think "hey I can actually do this! this isn't so bad, let's try to do a T1 nodewar." Having it be the SINGLE gear cap that matters (no separate T1 caps at varying levels), for multiple PVP modes (a T1 capped nodewar, RBF and BA), makes messaging easy as well. There is no complexity in getting the message out to new players - there is no "get this gear But well actually it's way more complex than this" -- it is just simple. New players can hit 240/300, the single number that is recommended, and then they can have fair (or as fair as is possible) PvP in several different modes, very accessibly and easily.  

 

This highly attainable goal will pump up new players and get them willing to buy-in and get started. Once they start having fun and doing this, they'll get really engaged with the game. The biggest concern I see are new players who do some quests, equp their narch + capotia set, DFS vs a 600+GS guy, lose in 1 hit, and they wonder what they even play the game for. Having a breadth of PvP options available to them as soon as they achieve 240/300 would be huge!   

  

Step 2: Increase PvP rewards

 

RedBattlefield rewards are very small. I wouldn't ask you to make them so good that people don't bother grinding in the actual world, but maybe improve the rewards at least so that even an RBF loss would pay for buff & consumable use and it's not an actual loss to participate. You currently do RBF because it is fun, if you have sufficient gear to compete. the rewards basically pay for your villa/church buff and a few giant draughts. In today's world of Elvia servers & high mastery lifeskilling, RBF ought to be at least as profitable as grinding abandoned iron mines...

 

Nodewar costs easily exceed the rewards except at the highesat of levels. Even for a player who only has 240/300 gear, participating in a 2 hour nodewar means they are giving up 2 hours of grind or lifeskilling, and the NW rewards are nowhere near as good as 2 hours of grinding, even at that gear level. Nodewars are not exactly spammable all day every day, so what is the harm in making the rewards just plain better? 

 

The idea behind increasing rewards is straightforward. I want more people excited about NW and RBF, I want to see more fresh faces step up and into the community. I want more guilds placing forts on nodes, and more players excited to show up for wars. When more players are enticed & lured into PvP, it is quite possible that they will find something they enjoy! A lot of players are nervous about starting PvP, or feel it just isn't worth it -- but cajole them enough, lure them in - and sometimes they are surprised to find how much fun it is! No one is as zealous as a convert, and I think I was leery of PvP when I started, too. I took some convincing. But now I am passionate. 

 

Step 3: propaganda campaign

 

After you make the changes in step 1 & 2, Pearl Abyss and the members of the Partner program gotta do their marketing magic. Make some good videos, a highlights/clips reel of players shouting into voice chat to DIVE DIVE DIVE KILL THAT FORT AHHH!!!, cool panning images of guild banners on city streets, an announcements page with a nice little guide - something!! to hype new players up and sell them on the idea that YOU TOO can participate in EPIC LARGESCALE PvP without grinding your soul away for 6+ months to gear up first. Show them all that Nodewar is COOL, and that with just the main story quest and a few hours of grind, you also can do it!! 

 

Remember this EVE video? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AdfFnTt2UT0 Yes check this out -- it's edited together community videos with real comms, some fancy orchestral music - and it's so hype, it really sells the idea that this game is something COOL, I mean just listen to how enthusiastic all these players are, how can it not hype you up? I barely ever played EVE myself (like 700 hours years and years and years ago) but watching this video sometimes still has me itching to reinstall and try it. 

 

We need some of the same sort of stuff for BDO, too.  

  

Go for it!

I can tell you're passionate and genuinely care about the game. Great explanations, reasonings, well written and makes sense.

 

I'm in full support. Please, take my heart!

Last Edit : Apr 15, 2021, 23:52 (UTC)
# 3

The only point I would perhaps disagree with is #2. I don't think PvP needs to have a silver incentive. Rather, I think that BDO needs to expand on non-silver incentives for people to participate in ALL activities in the game (RBF, Horse racing, NW etc.). Why not introduce house furniture, costumes or weapons that can only be earned by participating in X number of Nodewars? Trading in Red Seals? These are incentives that have no silver-value but still provide motivation for people to participate in PvP activities.

 

Other PvP activities have tried putting a silver reward before to compensate, but it's never worked out. It took BDO years to adjust the silver in RBF and nodewar payouts remain a joke - it's simply not a good method to promote PvP.

 

I don't want to get too far off topic, but the above applies to all other activities too. Why not make a custom horse costume for horse racing trophies? Maybe decorations for various nodewar buildings by playing Savage Rift or monster hats (like we got for kzarka) from AoB? Never understood why BDO has none of these when they're so obvious for promoting their gamemodes.

 

Lv Private
WinterRED
Last Edit : Apr 16, 2021, 00:54 (UTC)
# 4
On: Apr 15, 2021, 23:52 (UTC), Written by WinterRED

The only point I would perhaps disagree with is #2. I don't think PvP needs to have a silver incentive. Rather, I think that BDO needs to expand on non-silver incentives for people to participate in ALL activities in the game (RBF, Horse racing, NW etc.). Why not introduce house furniture, costumes or weapons that can only be earned by participating in X number of Nodewars? Trading in Red Seals? These are incentives that have no silver-value but still provide motivation for people to participate in PvP activities.

 

Other PvP activities have tried putting a silver reward before to compensate, but it's never worked out. It took BDO years to adjust the silver in RBF and nodewar payouts remain a joke - it's simply not a good method to promote PvP.

 

I don't want to get too far off topic, but the above applies to all other activities too. Why not make a custom horse costume for horse racing trophies? Maybe decorations for various nodewar buildings by playing Savage Rift or monster hats (like we got for kzarka) from AoB? Never understood why BDO has none of these when they're so obvious for promoting their gamemodes.

 

I'm not into housing, but thinking on your suggestion....seems really cool to have exclusive house furnishings earned via PVP.  Exclusive horse skins for Grand Prix, that sorta thing.  Yes, silver isn't the only thing that can motivate players, La Orzeca skin for example.  These possibilities surrounding PVP improvements is Hype 

Last Edit : Apr 16, 2021, 01:55 (UTC)
# 5
On: Apr 15, 2021, 23:52 (UTC), Written by WinterRED

The only point I would perhaps disagree with is #2. I don't think PvP needs to have a silver incentive. 

When silver directly influence the pvp combat (or in other words, gear), its kind of a must for pvp to reward you with silver.

 

Either that or make a special pvp gear that you can only earn and upgrade by pvp activities (like wow honor/arena gear).

 

 

To the OP of the thread, i fully support all of the ideas even though i unfortunately know it will never happen, i can still hope it will.

Last Edit : Apr 16, 2021, 03:26 (UTC)
# 6

I 100% support and agree with you Veltas!
Changes can be made, it all starts with one idea.

Its up to the rest of us to blow this thread up!

Thank you for taking your time and stepping up to bat for us.

Last Edit : Apr 16, 2021, 03:31 (UTC)
# 7

Yo this man is really speaking truth. Preach on, brother!

Last Edit : Apr 16, 2021, 07:27 (UTC)
# 8
On: Apr 15, 2021, 23:52 (UTC), Written by WinterRED

Why not introduce house furniture, costumes or weapons that can only be earned by participating in X number of Nodewars?

Good luck. Even caphras do not convince me to participate in RBF or any other unbalanced p2w pvp activity.

Furniture? To these tiny houses? I can barely fit in with what I got from the events. No one will invest more in houses because it requires CP, and CP is money from nodes/workshop/etc.

Costumes? Costumes = IS. PA never ever give us even one costume for free. I have not heard yet that someone managed to make "free" karlstein.

Weapons/gears? Same as costumes = IS. Buy costumes, melt costomes for crones, buy crones pack from IS.

You want more players for pvp? You need first balnce pvp. How? Removing disproportions. How? Easy: same hp, ap, dp stats for all palyers in pvp modes. Period. No one will take pvp modes seriously in which players with 20 dp more are "non-penetrative" for you.

Last Edit : Apr 16, 2021, 08:08 (UTC)
# 9

You know gear gate makes dem $$$, so they not goign to get rid of it. Noone would bother grinding, or using their convenience store to P2W your gear up, if it wouldn't give a heavy advantage.

Be happy that you even have t1...

244 4634
Lv 62
Hnnie
Last Edit : Apr 16, 2021, 08:36 (UTC)
# 10

 I enjoy RBF but i also want to not die every 5 sec as a newer player ... I like to pvp inbetween leveling and cooking lifeskilling etc so this would be great ! I aslo like RBF because i can practice my skills on other ppl without having to worry about  the open world pvp aspects . I like the instanced pvp alot , I fully support this idea . 

 

also "Why not introduce house furniture, costumes or weapons that can only be earned by participating in X number of Nodewars? Trading in Red Seals? These are incentives that have no silver-value but still provide motivation for people to participate in PvP activities."

 

I like this idea aswell !!! I just recently really got into like decorating my house alot and id love for this to happen ! 

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